Nostalgia and the 1963 Cup Final

Log in to stop seeing adverts
This page may contain links to companies such as eBay and Amazon. As an affiliate of these sites I may earn commission if you click the link and make a purchase

Status
Not open for further replies.

David Gwilliam

Well-Known Member
I have just watched a DVD of the 1963 Cup Final in which Man U defeated Leicester 3-1, Hopefully my comments will bring back memories and provoke reaction from those who were there. To declare my position right from the start I was a football fan in 1963 but did not become a Leicester supporter until the 1968-69 season. I arrived and we were relegated. I wanted to watch it in order to see the Matt Gillies team - players I had only heard of and players I had only seen as shadows of their former selves. I had earlier watched the 1959 cup final in which Bolton beat man U 2-0.

The better team won. Kenneth Wolstenholme said that the Leicester attack had been ineffective and the Leicester defence had been cut to ribbons.

Certainly Wolstenholme was correct about the Leicester attack. Keyworth was very tame until he scored an excellent goal. When I began supporting Leicester in 1969 I noticed how the crowd forgave Gibson and Stringfellow poor performances . I had hoped to see them at their best on the DVD but they both had a poor game. I was surprised to see Graham Cross as an inside forward since I remembered him as a fine centre back.

I thought Wolstenholme was unfair to the Leicester defence. They faced two world class players in Charlton and Law and any defence would have struggled. Two defenders I had only heard of Ian King and Ritchie Norman looked good. At one point a Leicester defender did a superb tackle and I thought “Wow. John Sjoberg has just dispossessed Bobby Charlton".

Watching the 1958 cup final as well gave me the chance to compare two great goalkeepers. With hindsight as a Leicester fan I have always been slightly embarrassed that until 1966 I thought Alf Ramsey was picking the wrong goalkeeper and that Eddie Hopkinson should never have been replaced by Gordon Banks. I now accept that Banks was one of the best goalkeepers in the world. Yet anyone looking at just the two cup finals looking at the twoCup finals would have said Hopkinson was the better. His performance was faultless and included two brilliant saves. They would have pointed out that Banks made a dreadful error for Man Us third goal

A few odd points. In 1958 the Man U trainer came onto the pitch in a suit and tie. By 1963 things were that bit more informal and the same trainer came on in a tracksuit. In the 1958 cup final a Bolton winger was described as being in the RAF and you realise that footballers did National Service. The excellent Bolton side included seven “local lads” and not one of the team had cost Bolton a transfer fee.
One last thought at the beginning of the 1958 final Nat Lofthouse (a centre forward who made Steve Howard look like Health & Safety Inpector) smashes into the Manchester United goalkeeper with no regard for his own or the other players safety. Kenneth Wolstenholme complains because Harry Gregg momentarily lost control of the ball. Later of course Lofthouse will knock Harry Gregg unconscious into the back of the net and the goal will be given. Kasper and Weale you do not know how lucky you are.
 
To declare my position right from the start I was a football fan in 1963 but did not become a Leicester supporter until the 1968-69 season.

What's the story David? Why did you follow Leicester in the end?
 
What's the story David? Why did you follow Leicester in the end?

I grew up supporting my home town of Worcester City. I only arrived in Leicester in 1968-69. As a boy my father would sometimes take me to see First Division matches if Birmingham or Wolves were playing interesting teams and like every non-league fan I had a "glory team" which was Manchester United (and then Bolton|) because of Duncan Edwards - the most unforgetable player I have ever seen.. I was also a Real Madrid fan - but then I cannot understand anyone who loved football not loving the Real Madrid of Puskas and Di Stefano.

It was the 1969 Cup Final which I watched on TV that made me realise that I was now a Leicester man and I became a Leicester supporter. My first reaction at my first Leicester match was amazement at how a goalkeeper of about 19 completely dominated his defence. It took one match to realise that Peter Shilton would become one of the world's great goalkeepers - indeed he developed into the best goalkeeper I have ever seen.
 
Well, I appreciate these nostalgia threads, so here's my 0.83 penn'orth.

I first started watching City in spring '63 and though I didn't have a ticket to Wembley, that took in the 4-3 win over Man U at Filbo which took us back to the top of the table, and the SF win at Hillsborough. Sadly, the only clear memory I have of the football I saw was the drab 0-0 at Bramall Lane, as it was the first game I had seen under floodlights and the bizarre sight of a top flight game being played in the corner of a cricket pitch - just like our jumpers for goalposts games on the local Recce. Still all that left me with the lifelong belief that supporting Leicester was blatant glory-grabbing and we were the elite. Happy days.

As to David's comments.

Ken Wolstenholme was an avid fan of the beautiful game and that and being from Manchester anyway ... still he was the voice of football in my youth so I forgive his obvious bias.

The 1958 final - the only time I have ever wanted a Man U win ever - no Paella and Cerveza parties that day - was against the thuggish Bolton louts of the fifties, and Busby's hastily assembled team after Munich were pretty lightweight. One of the forgotten bits of the Busby story was his rebuilt team had its fair share of hard men. A meathead called Maurice Setters at the back, Paddy Crerand, an excellent creative footballer was more than partial to doing what was necessary, often when it wasn't. Mr Niggly, Nobby Stiles was still a year away from breaking into that team, but anyway in '63 we were the lightweights.

Both Charlton (in 1963 seen as a good player with an explosive shot in both feet) and Law (overpriced goalhanger and nowhere as prolific as another returning Italy exile, the trim and probably sober Jimmy Greaves at Spurs) hadn't reached the legend status by some way. Man U were not seen as strong opposition - Tottenham, Burnley and Wolves were seen as the top teams we measured ourselves by, though the newly promoted Liverpool and the soon to be promoted Leeds soon showed us that was yesterday.

The Cross/McLintock crossover was basically the heart of the Leicester counter-attacking style, though in all fairness to the Tank it was Frank's forays into attack that thrilled the crowd, if only Gary Mac had been around twenty years earlier, we might have gone all the way.

With the harsh winter of 62-63, basically the second half of the season was compressed into two months from mid-March to mid-May. City played a number of home games whilst the big freeze was on, some sort of antifreeze put on the ground, killed the grass but it was playable. I think most teams were playing three games a week in April, so tiredness played a part for both teams - IIRC the first half hour was full of poor football and defensive errors from both teams, if only we'd got the first goal and settled down - not them, if only.

The final bit of hindsight is that the 4th spot and a final appearance wasn't disappointing at all - we were on the up and things were only going to get better, and the future reality - ambitious quality players like McLintock inevitably heading for the door marked exit (even if in Frank's case it was to a demonstrably inferior Arsenal side) was something I was yet to experience .... over and over and over and ....
 
I think you are taking advantage of the fact that David has gone on record as saying he doesn't insult forum members :icon_wink

Nope - I'm taking advantage of the fact that all those who do have either buggered off for good, are busy sulking, are on holiday or are currently held bound and gagged in my garage.
 
Nope - I'm taking advantage of the fact that all those who do have either buggered off for good, are busy sulking, are on holiday or are currently held bound and gagged in my garage.

You missed one.


You ****ing **** :icon_wink
 
I think you are taking advantage of the fact that David has gone on record as saying he doesn't insult forum members :icon_wink

Nearly true.
I have sharply criticized the bad judgement of one Forum member. It was the one who thought the board was right to sack Jimmy Bloomfield, thought Martin O'Neill was ruining Mark McGhees good work and showed a picture of Peter Taylor to some bemused American architects with the words "This is the greatest ever Englishman."
Modesty prevents me naming this idiot.

As for the rest whether it be the area I sit in the stadium, the garden of my favourite tea rooms or this Football Forum if I did not find it excellent company I would move.
 
As for the rest whether it be the area I sit in the stadium, the garden of my favourite tea rooms or this Football Forum if I did not find it excellent company I would move.

If the company here is excellent then I, for one, would really hesitate to take tea wherever you do.
 
Last edited:
63 was perhaps the final out of all four FA Cup appearances we really should have won. United had class but had really a poor season. It's been said had we not dropped off the pace for the Championship and been competing in the last few games of the season, we might have put on a better display in the final

To know that we once pushed for League and FA Cup honours in the same season is almost unimaginable to me, then I look and see Burnley did it the season before.
 
As for the rest whether it be the area I sit in the stadium, the garden of my favourite tea rooms or this Football Forum if I did not find it excellent company I would move.

Was it one of the Marx brothers who said he would never be a member of a club that would have him as a member?
 
Well, I appreciate these nostalgia threads, so here's my 0.83 penn'orth.

I first started watching City in spring '63 and though I didn't have a ticket to Wembley, that took in the 4-3 win over Man U at Filbo which took us back to the top of the table, and the SF win at Hillsborough. Sadly, the only clear memory I have of the football I saw was the drab 0-0 at Bramall Lane, as it was the first game I had seen under floodlights and the bizarre sight of a top flight game being played in the corner of a cricket pitch - just like our jumpers for goalposts games on the local Recce. Still all that left me with the lifelong belief that supporting Leicester was blatant glory-grabbing and we were the elite. Happy days.

As to David's comments.

Ken Wolstenholme was an avid fan of the beautiful game and that and being from Manchester anyway ... still he was the voice of football in my youth so I forgive his obvious bias.

The 1958 final - the only time I have ever wanted a Man U win ever - no Paella and Cerveza parties that day - was against the thuggish Bolton louts of the fifties, and Busby's hastily assembled team after Munich were pretty lightweight. One of the forgotten bits of the Busby story was his rebuilt team had its fair share of hard men. A meathead called Maurice Setters at the back, Paddy Crerand, an excellent creative footballer was more than partial to doing what was necessary, often when it wasn't. Mr Niggly, Nobby Stiles was still a year away from breaking into that team, but anyway in '63 we were the lightweights.

Both Charlton (in 1963 seen as a good player with an explosive shot in both feet) and Law (overpriced goalhanger and nowhere as prolific as another returning Italy exile, the trim and probably sober Jimmy Greaves at Spurs) hadn't reached the legend status by some way. Man U were not seen as strong opposition - Tottenham, Burnley and Wolves were seen as the top teams we measured ourselves by, though the newly promoted Liverpool and the soon to be promoted Leeds soon showed us that was yesterday.

The Cross/McLintock crossover was basically the heart of the Leicester counter-attacking style, though in all fairness to the Tank it was Frank's forays into attack that thrilled the crowd, if only Gary Mac had been around twenty years earlier, we might have gone all the way.

With the harsh winter of 62-63, basically the second half of the season was compressed into two months from mid-March to mid-May. City played a number of home games whilst the big freeze was on, some sort of antifreeze put on the ground, killed the grass but it was playable. I think most teams were playing three games a week in April, so tiredness played a part for both teams - IIRC the first half hour was full of poor football and defensive errors from both teams, if only we'd got the first goal and settled down - not them, if only.

The final bit of hindsight is that the 4th spot and a final appearance wasn't disappointing at all - we were on the up and things were only going to get better, and the future reality - ambitious quality players like McLintock inevitably heading for the door marked exit (even if in Frank's case it was to a demonstrably inferior Arsenal side) was something I was yet to experience .... over and over and over and ....
 
I was 10 years old - I remember getting up for school and seeing a couple of tickets on the sideboard for the 5th round game at Leyton Orient which we won 1-0 with a goal from Ken Keyworth in the 6th min - I didn't go to the final but watched it on the tv - blarted at the final whistle - we should have won the double that season - have a look at the clubs we played in the last month - most of them were near the bottom of the league and we lost most of them if my memory serves me right - Man Utd although having Law Herd and Charlton finished near the bottom of the league - We should have won the final but we just didn't turn up
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Log in to stop seeing adverts

P Pld Pts
1Liverpool2150
2Arsenal2244
3Nottm F2141
4Newcastle2238
5Chelsea2137
6Bournemouth2237
7Aston Villa2236
8Manchester C  2135
9Fulham2233
10Brighton2131
11Brentford2228
12Palace2227
13Manchester U2126
14West Ham2226
15Tottenham 2124
16Everton2017
17Wolves2116
18Ipswich2116
19Leicester2214
20Southampton216

Latest posts

Back
Top