General Election 7th May 2015

[Mawsley]

Bloody pedants.

 

[David Gwilliam]

My peace time political hero is Aneurin Bevan. I thought of him when I received some election literature from Jon Ashworth the Labour MP for Leicester South. Someone once told Bevan that if a donkey stood as Labour candidate in South Wales he would win. "In that case" said Bevan "it is important that we do not pick donkeys."

The election literature was a surprise because Jon Ashworth had shown no sign that he realised Aylestone was in his constituency. In his four years as an MP I have never seen him in the area and his election literature mentions a number of areas but not Aylestone.

Bevan worked as a coal miner and his politics grew out of the poverty faced by people in South Wales. Ashworth left university to work first for Gordon Brown and then Ed Miliband. He even married a Labour regional organizer. He is a career politician and has no connection with the people of Leicester.

In 1951 Bevan threw away his chances of becoming Labour Party leader over a point of principle. He resigned from the government over prescription charges. Bevan maintained that once you start charging for the NHS it becomes the thin end of the wedge. What would he have said about increasing privatisation of the NHS. He then hurt his position as the great figure on the left by his refusal to support CND - supporting multilateral disarmament rather than unilateral disarmament.
In contrast Jon Ashworth reminds me of W S Gilbert's MP who
Always voted at my party's call
And never thought of thinking for myself at all."

I strongly agree with Nigel Farage on the European Union but strongly disagree on other policies. No doubt Mr Ashworth will be as supine as his leader over Europe.
I like The Green Movement and agree with the Green Party on the NHS but think many of the policies of the Green Party are silly. Mr Ashworth will never do anything silly.
I may end up having to vote for New Labour.

Is it too late for Nicola Sturgeon to stand in Leicester South?.

 

[Macky]

My peace time political hero is Aneurin Bevan.

...

I may end up having to vote for New Labour.

Those are two sentences that just do not belong together. I'm not even sure how those two sentences could possibly be the product of the same mind.
If Nye Bevan is your political hero, then surely voting for a right-wing Neoliberal party would be akin to taking a piss against Bevan's headstone?

 

[jb5000]

Nye Bevan famously said that the NHS would get cheaper with time. The NHS was not re-organised from his original vision until 1974, by when he'd been proven categorically wrong. Considering that he was carrying out the vision of William Beveridge (a Liberal), I'd wish for competent political leaders rather than lionising yet another socialist who only knew how to spend until the money ran out.

 

[David Gwilliam]

Those are two sentences that just do not belong together. I'm not even sure how those two sentences could possibly be the product of the same mind.
If Nye Bevan is your political hero, then surely voting for a right-wing Neoliberal party would be akin to taking a piss against Bevan's headstone?

I had tried to convey that my vote for Mr Ashworth was extremely reluctant and that Nicola Sturgeon is closer to my values than Ed Miliband. There are those who see no difference between the Conservatives and Labour. I prefer to say that there is not enough difference. However, I do not believe that Labour would have brought in a bedroom tax or penalised students as badly. I do not say the NHS is safe with Labour; I do say that it is safer than with the Conservatives. There are alternatives. I respect those who vote UKIP over Europe or Green over climate change but too many of their policies are not for me.

To be pedantic
(1) I have never understood the word neo-liberal. The policies they describe have no connection to Gladstone or Lloyd George - both of whom I believe would have been Labour if born a century later.
(2) Aneurin Bevan did not have a headstone. He did not need a headstone; seeing the doctor and nurse without worrying whether you can afford it - that is Aneurin Bevan's memorial.

 

[jb5000]

I had tried to convey that my vote for Mr Ashworth was extremely reluctant and that Nicola Sturgeon is closer to my values than Ed Miliband. There are those who see no difference between the Conservatives and Labour. I prefer to say that there is not enough difference. However, I do not believe that Labour would have brought in a bedroom tax or penalised students as badly. I do not say the NHS is safe with Labour; I do say that it is safer than with the Conservatives. There are alternatives. I respect those who vote UKIP over Europe or Green over climate change but too many of their policies are not for me.

To be pedantic
(1) I have never understood the word neo-liberal. The policies they describe have no connection to Gladstone or Lloyd George - both of whom I believe would have been Labour if born a century later.
(2) Aneurin Bevan did not have a headstone. He did not need a headstone; seeing the doctor and nurse without worrying whether you can afford it - that is Aneurin Bevan's memorial.

Labour did bring in the bedroom tax - they applied it to people in the private rented sector when they were in government. Why was it right for private rents, and not council and housing association rents? Also, all councils were given money by the government to form discretionary funds to allieviate the worse problems it caused. Why did so many Labour run council return that money? Are they playing politics with people's lives?

The Labour party, having introduced and raised tuition fees despite (1) promising not to, and (2) having a majority big enough to deliver their pledge, fought the last election with the same university funding policy as the Conservatives - to deliver the (at the time unpublished) Browne Report. Once published, this called for unlimited fees and no student support. The new system does set a higher fee but also gives more support to students while they are studying, and they pay back smaller amounts and start repaying only when earning a higher salary. If the new system is so bad, why are more applying to go to university? Why has the number from the poorest 10% of families doubled? Why are a record number of families sending a son or daughter to university for the first time?

You are right that the term 'neo-liberal' has nothing to do with Gladstone or Lloyd-George (although the idea that either, particularly Gladstone, would have any truck with Labour is a none starter). Neither is it anything to do with Nick Clegg, when it is not being used by people on the left-to-far-left as a stick to beat those they disagree with, it is a term more properly used to describe the economic policies of those on the right of the Conservative and UKIP parties - John Redwood and Jacob Rees-Mogg immediately spring to mind.

 

[spionfox]

He is a career politician and has no connection with the people of <insert constituency here>

Aren't they all nowadays?

No life experience at all, merely card carrying fodder towing the party line. Oh, but they can 'do' social media - hurrah.

 

[fitz]

"If the new system is so bad, why are more applying to go to university?"

i agree with a fair bit of your post. My personal feeling on this bit is that Universities are there to make money these days, you can get a degree in pretty much anything and even without qualifications under your belt you'll get in somewhere. Saves getting a job for some low repayment debt and some years on the piss.The system has been devalued but helps the jobless figures come down though.

 

[fitz]

Aren't they all nowadays?

No life experience at all, merely card carrying fodder towing the party line. Oh, but they can 'do' social media - hurrah.

I've moved house between 4 constituencies over the years, 3 safe labour seats and now in a safe Tory seat. People vote the same and the efforts show, the opposing parties probably haven't bothered leaving the house as I've never had any leaflets or anything to let me know what my alternative would be.

 

[bocadillo]

I've never had any leaflets or anything to let me know what my alternative would be.

Living in South Thanet, where Nigel Farage has decided once again to chance his arm, the situation is more than slightly different. With 11 candidates, three of whom have a realistic chance of being elected, our pile of election bumph is now reaching telephone directory proportions. We've even each had a personal (and identical) letter from the Prime Minister, though surprisingly nothing yet from the Al-Ababist Nation of Ooog candidate.

So much choice and so little to choose from!

 

[fitz]

Living in South Thanet, where Nigel Farage has decided once again to chance his arm, the situation is more than slightly different. With 11 candidates, three of whom have a realistic chance of being elected, our pile of election bumph is now reaching telephone directory proportions. We've even each had a personal (and identical) letter from the Prime Minister, though surprisingly nothing yet from the Al-Ababist Nation of Ooog candidate.

So much choice and so little to choose from!

Yet Al-Ababist Nation of Ooog seems like the smartest option.

 

[Blue Maniac]

Living in South Thanet, where Nigel Farage has decided once again to chance his arm, the situation is more than slightly different. With 11 candidates, three of whom have a realistic chance of being elected, our pile of election bumph is now reaching telephone directory proportions. We've even each had a personal (and identical) letter from the Prime Minister, though surprisingly nothing yet from the Al-Ababist Nation of Ooog candidate.

So much choice and so little to choose from!

Al-Zebabist?

 

[bocadillo]

Al-Zebabist?

Yes

 

[Jeff]

I think I'm going to vote for Alfred. His leaflet might be a shambles but he means well.

 

[OldGit]

Is it too late for Nicola Sturgeon to stand in Leicester South?.

Are you sure?


Have you ever seen them in the same room?

 

[jb5000]

"If the new system is so bad, why are more applying to go to university?"

i agree with a fair bit of your post. My personal feeling on this bit is that Universities are there to make money these days, you can get a degree in pretty much anything and even without qualifications under your belt you'll get in somewhere. Saves getting a job for some low repayment debt and some years on the piss.The system has been devalued but helps the jobless figures come down though.

I honestly think that's a bit hard on kids. Leicester Uni is a very successful traditional university, but De Montfort has got a really record of getting people in to jobs with business skills that the trad uni often overlooks a bit. It is also good at getting people through a degree who have been out of education for a few years and didn't do well in the traditional school environment. I remember they were my back up option, needing two Ds at A level if I didn't get in to dirty Leeds (BBC). Without the culture of retakes that we had at GCSE (now thankfully stamped out), it's possible for a student to have a few bad days on their exams and need a back up like that.

Also, a lot of funny-subject stories that appear in the press end up to just be regarding a course or module within a degree (for context, my degree contained 32 modules and a major project)

Universities do need to make money, but the only way they can make anything close to break-even is through overseas students who are charged a lot more.

Having said all that though, I certainly remember kids at my university who were there because they didn't have anything better to do. Generally they didn't work at it and either dropped out or eked out poor degrees, and didn't get great jobs. There's no way they were close to a majority though, and I wouldn't want to see a clampdown that would just as likely stop other people going.

 

[Blaarev]

Luckyly we havn't an election until the autumn.

 

[Motown Fox]

:icon_lol: I saw this afternoon at work and couldn't help laughing

Are you sure?
View attachment 11872

Have you ever seen them in the same room?

 

[fitz]

I honestly think that's a bit hard on kids. Leicester Uni is a very successful traditional university, but De Montfort has got a really record of getting people in to jobs with business skills that the trad uni often overlooks a bit. It is also good at getting people through a degree who have been out of education for a few years and didn't do well in the traditional school environment. I remember they were my back up option, needing two Ds at A level if I didn't get in to dirty Leeds (BBC). Without the culture of retakes that we had at GCSE (now thankfully stamped out), it's possible for a student to have a few bad days on their exams and need a back up like that.

Also, a lot of funny-subject stories that appear in the press end up to just be regarding a course or module within a degree (for context, my degree contained 32 modules and a major project)

Universities do need to make money, but the only way they can make anything close to break-even is through overseas students who are charged a lot more.

Having said all that though, I certainly remember kids at my university who were there because they didn't have anything better to do. Generally they didn't work at it and either dropped out or eked out poor degrees, and didn't get great jobs. There's no way they were close to a majority though, and I wouldn't want to see a clampdown that would just as likely stop other people going.

I wouldn't include Leicester or DMU in what I was saying. I know from my days of UCAS applications that there's plenty others who will take anyone to do anything, people who have got a U at a-level in their degree subject and so on. There are plenty of courses which have fast tracks/top-ups from college NVQ that don't actually lead into any career. Fair enough we should let people have an opportunity for further studies but if they're not a high level qualification then they should be classified as an NVQ3 or equivalent.

 

[Matt_B]

I wouldn't include Leicester or DMU in what I was saying. I know from my days of UCAS applications that there's plenty others who will take anyone to do anything, people who have got a U at a-level in their degree subject and so on. There are plenty of courses which have fast tracks/top-ups from college NVQ that don't actually lead into any career. Fair enough we should let people have an opportunity for further studies but if they're not a high level qualification then they should be classified as an NVQ3 or equivalent.

The problem lies with deciding what is and isn't useful or higher level. Some don't think the arts should be valid degrees, some will think English majors may be but not the classics. Do you tie it entirely do the relevance of a job afterwards?