Fickle boneheads

[Yorkshire Vixen]

i agree with you unfortunately :icon_cry:

 

[Chuck T Masala]

I guess the favoured outcome for me is that, we suddenly start winning and get enough points to survive and I would much rather we did this with CL remaining just to avoid the fecking cattle market auction that happens when a replacement is sought. But, I don't see any evidence that this will happen, very little on show to be optomistic about. Doing nothing just goes against my nature. To fail will be a disaster, to fail and to have done nothing or not enough (I know new signing Matty scored and thats a positive) seems unacceptable to me. We have a very limited number of games to save ourselves from the drop, what ever we do will have to be pretty radical.

Just a thought during a rather black moment.

Come on city stuff it right up Pymouth and bring me a little light. Stiil my team even when you are utter kak.

 

[Yorkshire Vixen]

i agree chuck would want him to stay and get us out of this mess then be told to sling his 'ook in t'summer - like you say though not a great deal of evidence that this is going to happen

 

[Matt_B]

i agree chuck would want him to stay and get us out of this mess then be told to sling his 'ook in t'summer - like you say though not a great deal of evidence that this is going to happen

My worry is if he keeps us up, the board will let him stay and we will be back down here having these same arguments and discussions next January

 

[Chuck T Masala]

But we have to stay up, whatever the cost....dont' we?

 

[Matt_B]

But we have to stay up, whatever the cost....dont' we?

Yes, but I really need all the people who ask for CL to stay to answer one question.

What will suddenly change? If we were playing well and looking like winning but giving away silly goals we could tighten up, but we never even look like challenging for a win. So all you lot answer me, why the confidence? What do you see changing?

 

[Mike - True Blue Tinter]

I will answer yours, if you answer mine!

I think CL should stay unless the board know he has 'lost' the dressing room, so nothing is going to get better, i.e. confidence, motivation, tactics etc. If the players genuinely back him publicly, or privately to the board, then he should stay. To get rid might cause more mayhem.

Why are you certain it is the manager's fault? Why do you want to get rid? Can you be more certain that a new manager (Gary Mac, Keegan, anyone else currently unemployed) and this squad will definitely start winning just because it is a different manager?

 

[Matt_B]

I will answer yours, if you answer mine!

I think CL should stay unless the board know he has 'lost' the dressing room, so nothing is going to get better, i.e. confidence, motivation, tactics etc. If the players genuinely back him publicly, or privately to the board, then he should stay. To get rid might cause more mayhem.

Why are you certain it is the manager's fault? Why do you want to get rid? Can you be more certain that a new manager (Gary Mac, Keegan, anyone else currently unemployed) and this squad will definitely start winning just because it is a different manager?

All valid points:

1. I am not certain it is the managers fault, but the buck has to stop with him
2. I want to get rid in the hope that change may liven up the squad. Other managers have turned around teams in less time than CL has had, I do not think he is good enough.
3. I am definately not certain that a new manager would keep us up, but I do not want to be sitting in League 1 next season having done nothing. If CL stays I have zero confidence that next season will be any different.

Now answer mine!

 

[Mike - True Blue Tinter]

We are changing. We do play better. With the exception of Izzet and Lennon, this squad all have better ball skills than a MON side had. I will reserve judgement on Douglas's ball skills! He never has a lot to do, except pick the ball out of the net! That means the defence generally is doing its job but like the rest of the team is inconsistent and makes occasional mistakes, marking, passing, whatever, that lets the other team in.

We have a young squad, (Board and most fans number 1 priority), who are therefore inexperienced. They are also relatively 'small'. Dublin and MDV are the only big boys, so we are often muscled off the ball. Training and experience will make our squad 'stronger' in the future, and better able to compete against the 'rugby' teams of Cardiff etc.

All of the players have shown the ability to play well at times. We just need them all to play well every game for the whole game. Not just against Sheff Utd and Spurs. And to play as a team. It took MON several years to build a really good team, and he did not start with zero money!

You can not get big strong experienced players in 18-22 year old bodies on our budget. We cannot buy six Wayne Rooneys. As much as it irritates some fans, the likes of MDV and Dublin have an important role to play to strengthen the team and provide an experienced 'spine' for these potentially good youngsters to develop alongside.

Where can I see the changes. We do still chase the game if we go one down. There is still confidence even without the support of the fans.

I would rather change some of our fans than our manager at the moment, unless someone can convince me that a different manager would guarantee we would win matches! If the squad do not believe the manager is 'broken', changing the manager because you cannot think of anything better to do could be hugely de-motivating to them.

 

[webmaster]

With the exception of Izzet and Lennon, this squad all have better ball skills than a MON side had.

While to an extent I agree with what you're saying, I think you may be over estmating some of our current players.

Do we have any defenders as composed on the ball, and who can pass like Elliott?
Wingers who can cross the ball like Guppy? (or even Impey!)
Strikers who can hold the ball up and pass it as well as Claridge or Marshall?

 

[Matt_B]

We are changing. We do play better. With the exception of Izzet and Lennon, this squad all have better ball skills than a MON side had. I will reserve judgement on Douglas's ball skills! He never has a lot to do, except pick the ball out of the net! That means the defence generally is doing its job but like the rest of the team is inconsistent and makes occasional mistakes, marking, passing, whatever, that lets the other team in.

We have a young squad, (Board and most fans number 1 priority), who are therefore inexperienced. They are also relatively 'small'. Dublin and MDV are the only big boys, so we are often muscled off the ball. Training and experience will make our squad 'stronger' in the future, and better able to compete against the 'rugby' teams of Cardiff etc.

All of the players have shown the ability to play well at times. We just need them all to play well every game for the whole game. Not just against Sheff Utd and Spurs. And to play as a team. It took MON several years to build a really good team, and he did not start with zero money!

You can not get big strong experienced players in 18-22 year old bodies on our budget. We cannot buy six Wayne Rooneys. As much as it irritates some fans, the likes of MDV and Dublin have an important role to play to strengthen the team and provide an experienced 'spine' for these potentially good youngsters to develop alongside.

Where can I see the changes. We do still chase the game if we go one down. There is still confidence even without the support of the fans.

I would rather change some of our fans than our manager at the moment, unless someone can convince me that a different manager would guarantee we would win matches! If the squad do not believe the manager is 'broken', changing the manager because you cannot think of anything better to do could be hugely de-motivating to them.

I agree in potential with what you are saying. Just a few points though.

Whilst alot of players could be argued to have better ball skills, we still make alot of erroneous passes, and none of the so called "skilled" players seem to want to put in the effort. I was a huge fan of Smith, but he didn't seem arsed on Saturday.

Why are we only chasing the game if we go one down? That shows a lack of confidence to me, only risking going forward when we have no choice. We should going out guns blazing from the start.

On a side note, I do not class MDV as a "big-boy", I think for such a tall built guy he gets muscled off the ball way to easily.

I love the fact that the team is alot younger, but you still need experience in there.

In all honesty, I hope CL changes things and we start winning and progress next year up the table. But I don't see it happening. I think he has vastly underestemated the strength of this league and is now floundering. Why did he leace his substitutions until 75mins when the game was long burried? I think he thought "it's the English 2nd tier, it can't be as good as the SPL" and now he's realised it is a totally different game, and one his squad is incable of dealing with

 

[Matt_B]

While to an extent I agree with what you're saying, I think you may be over estmating some of our current players.

Do we have any defenders as composed on the ball, and who can pass like Elliott?
Wingers who can cross the ball like Guppy? (or even Impey!)
Strikers who can hold the ball up and pass it as well as Claridge or Marshall?

Which raises an interesting point I mentioned at the weekend but got shot down for...

We keep saying maybe CL can't motivate the players, maybe they are motivated, and they are just not very good. Maybe this is the best they can do, and games like Spurs and Sheff Utd were just flukes? I cannot see how else a bunch of so called talented individuals could continuously play so badly!

 

[alex]

While to an extent I agree with what you're saying, I think you may be over estmating some of our current players.

Do we have any defenders as composed on the ball, and who can pass like Elliott?
Wingers who can cross the ball like Guppy? (or even Impey!)
Strikers who can hold the ball up and pass it as well as Claridge or Marshall?

No, no and no. Not yet anyways....

 

[Chuck T Masala]

While to an extent I agree with what you're saying, I think you may be over estmating some of our current players.

Do we have any defenders as composed on the ball, and who can pass like Elliott?
Wingers who can cross the ball like Guppy? (or even Impey!)
Strikers who can hold the ball up and pass it as well as Claridge or Marshall?

No we don't, Neither do we have a manager who could extract performances out of players beyond what had been seen before, or change the course of a game with a half time talk, or who created such a positive atmosphere around the club.

 

[Mike - True Blue Tinter]

I agree with you!

I do not think our players generally are very good! They are probably as good or better than you could get for the money they cost. MDV cost £50,000. Some of our fans think he should be able to play like Thierry Henry FFS!

We have a bargain basement young squad who might develop into a good team. They are not Junior Lewis clones, though some fans might argue that Kisnorbo is trying for that honour!

CL put his hands up and admitted he got it wrong with Gilbert, who apparently had the wrong attitude to training, fitting into the team, was just useless, or whatever, and he got rid.

The crucial question is: Is CL the man to turn these 'average' youngsters into a good team?

MON took a bunch of donkeys, many of them, and convinced them that they were racehorses.

Who can perform the same trick with our young 'foals'?

 

[bocadillo]

MON took a bunch of donkeys, many of them, and convinced them that they were racehorses.

Nonsense! In the previous four seasons City had been in the secong-tier play-offs 3 times; in the previous season they had been in the Prem. MON simply finished a development task that had been started by Brian Little and Mark McGhee - and finished it very well too.

CL, by contrast, took over a club that was in deep decline and in most ways has done exactly what the board asked of him (see Tim Davies' announcement at the end of last week) OK, he hasn't got the results that we would like on the field but he has for the moment secured the future of the club; something other managers might not have been able to do.

Would we have preferred no City at all?

 

[Leesoh]

i agree chuck would want him to stay and get us out of this mess then be told to sling his 'ook in t'summer - like you say though not a great deal of evidence that this is going to happen

My worry is if he keeps us up, the board will let him stay and we will be back down here having these same arguments and discussions next January

My thoughts, and fears, funnily.

I think it's getting too late now for someone to come in and change it. But I don't think CL is the man for us. Not any more. :icon_sad:

 

[Brauny Blue]

My worry is if he keeps us up, the board will let him stay and we will be back down here having these same arguments and discussions next January

Doubt it, if we survive this season then CL will start on a tightrope from day 1 next season. Can't see him lasting beyond October if we start badly again. Plus the further through his contract he go's the easier it is for us to sack him

 

[Chuck T Masala]

Might he do the honourable thing and resign if we go down?

 

[Yorkshire Vixen]

apparently chuck its not leveins way to walk out of a situation