Financial Fair Play

[Blue Maniac]

We did? I must have missed that. Certainly didn't see any scuff marks on coke heads kit or gloves.

Who?

 

[spionfox]

Who?

Oh come on BM, you know who coke head is surely?!

 

[Matt_B]

Oh come on BM, you know who coke head is surely?!

So not coke at all then?

 

[spionfox]

So not coke at all then?

Not at all, no. Just using a generic term to describe someone who failed a drugs test.

The fact that the generic term is not at all applicable to Mr Kenny is duly noted.

 

[SwedeFox]

Still a fat Canute, though.

 

[doolochfox]

According to a recent FB message from FIFA I am the lucky recipient of a sizable wedge. Can I gift it to the club? Is this allowed under FFP? I do not want any equity/ equity dilution in return. If I am able to do this, are the owners able to do the same?

 

[Mawsley]

Organisations like the FT have little or nothing to so with 'community ownership' - its basically just a few busy bodies realising that the most likely route to gaining some leverage on the local football club is if all the clubs outside the Premier League are reduced the level of a Northampton Town.

What a load of absolute bollocks.

Northampton Town isn't run by the Trust. Nor is the NTFC Supporters Trust gaining leverage due to the lowly nature of the club.

It was the very first Trust of its kind to be created in the entire country, in January 1992, and since then there have been many trusts formed across this country and overseas.

Since it's formation:

Growth: Supporters’ trusts have now been established at over 160 clubs.

Membership: Over 120,000 people are members of supporters’ trusts.

Finance: Supporters’ trusts have now brought in well over £25 million of new finance into football and rugby league.

Ownership: 15 clubs are in ownership or control by supporters trusts.

Partnership: Over 110 supporters’ trusts now have shareholdings in their clubs.

Boardroom: Nearly 60 supporters’ trusts have directors at their clubs. Over 50% of these are directly elected by the membership of the trust.

Reach: Supporters of nearly 70% of clubs in the top five divisions of football in England, and the top four divisions in Scotland have established supporters’ trusts.

Community: Reorientating clubs to deliver active community engagement.

Northampton Town a now a well-run club which operates within its means. The Trust has the goodwill of the fanbase because they are very well run and highly visible. The Trust are respected by the club and have had direct influence in helping it to become responsible with money and drive its community focus forward.

Just because the FT continually refuse to say how many members they have or be more proactive does not mean that the entire Trust movement is "basically just a few busy bodies" acting with the aim of "gaining some leverage on the local football club". That is just utter, factually inaccurate tripe.


Some of this post was copy-pasted from http://www.ntfctrust.co.uk

 

[Mawsley]

Oh, and Brian Lomax is a really good egg who is intelligent, industrious and engaged the whole fanbase.

 

[Biffa Bacon]

What a load of absolute bollocks.

Northampton Town isn't run by the Trust. Nor is the NTFC Supporters Trust gaining leverage due to the lowly nature of the club.

It was the very first Trust of its kind to be created in the entire country, in January 1992, and since then there have been many trusts formed across this country and overseas.

Since it's formation:

Growth: Supporters’ trusts have now been established at over 160 clubs.

Membership: Over 120,000 people are members of supporters’ trusts.

Finance: Supporters’ trusts have now brought in well over £25 million of new finance into football and rugby league.

Ownership: 15 clubs are in ownership or control by supporters trusts.

Partnership: Over 110 supporters’ trusts now have shareholdings in their clubs.

Boardroom: Nearly 60 supporters’ trusts have directors at their clubs. Over 50% of these are directly elected by the membership of the trust.

Reach: Supporters of nearly 70% of clubs in the top five divisions of football in England, and the top four divisions in Scotland have established supporters’ trusts.

Community: Reorientating clubs to deliver active community engagement.

Northampton Town a now a well-run club which operates within its means. The Trust has the goodwill of the fanbase because they are very well run and highly visible. The Trust are respected by the club and have had direct influence in helping it to become responsible with money and drive its community focus forward.

Just because the FT continually refuse to say how many members they have or be more proactive does not mean that the entire Trust movement is "basically just a few busy bodies" acting with the aim of "gaining some leverage on the local football club". That is just utter, factually inaccurate tripe.


Some of this post was copy-pasted from http://www.ntfctrust.co.uk

I have to agree with that, just because the Foxes Trust is not fit for purpose you can't disregard the Trust movement. I'm in favour of Leicester having a Trust which works well but Supporters Direct doesn't have a mechanism to remove failed or failing Trusts and replace them.

 

[Darth Vodka]

if I brought a football club.

brought it where? into the modern game?

 

[OldGit]

I have to agree with that, just because the Foxes Trust is not fit for purpose you can't disregard the Trust movement. I'm in favour of Leicester having a Trust which works well but Supporters Direct doesn't have a mechanism to remove failed or failing Trusts and replace them.

But those who complain do - join and vote

 

[Biffa Bacon]

But those who complain do - join and vote

No thanks, the Foxes Trust refuses to be open and straight with the clubs supporters and requires people to join before sharing such basics as how many active members it has, I'll not join anything that isn't straight and honest up front.

In this thread they have admitted they have no pathway to meaningful involvement in the clubs administration.

 

[Mawsley]

But those who complain do - join and vote

Do you think an individual can change it?

It would require a large number to join in order to outvote the current members and start moving it forward. We're talking a lot of motivated and able people too.

Probably 6.

 

[spionfox]

if I brought a football club......

brought it where? into the modern game?

The educational benefits of this forum should be promoted far more than they currently are :icon_wink

 

[Redditch Fox]

I'm not disagreeing with that; my point was that the Prem is often incredibly boring to watch. I blame teams battling for draws as every point helps their main goal, avoiding relegation.

My point was that the Leeds game was a seriously bad advert for Championship football.

You are absolutely right in that televised premier league games are also often boring - but no matter how boring the game and or alternatively uninteresting the premier league fixture (to the neutral) example would be say Southampton v Crystal Palace, the premier league clubs don't have the same issue of financial restraints. In fact there are just a handful of top clubs that attract most of the interest as far as television and the neutral is concerned...but my point is that games like last Sunday just confirm to the wider public that only top flight games are worth watching. By the way I take an old fashioned view that a home side like Leicester in that game have a sort of obligation to give it a go - and not settle for a sterile draw/ hope that they can nick a late goal.

 

[Redditch Fox]

What a load of absolute bollocks.

Northampton Town isn't run by the Trust. Nor is the NTFC Supporters Trust gaining leverage due to the lowly nature of the club.

It was the very first Trust of its kind to be created in the entire country, in January 1992, and since then there have been many trusts formed across this country and overseas.

Since it's formation:

Growth: Supporters’ trusts have now been established at over 160 clubs.

Membership: Over 120,000 people are members of supporters’ trusts.

Finance: Supporters’ trusts have now brought in well over £25 million of new finance into football and rugby league.

Ownership: 15 clubs are in ownership or control by supporters trusts.

Partnership: Over 110 supporters’ trusts now have shareholdings in their clubs.

Boardroom: Nearly 60 supporters’ trusts have directors at their clubs. Over 50% of these are directly elected by the membership of the trust.

Reach: Supporters of nearly 70% of clubs in the top five divisions of football in England, and the top four divisions in Scotland have established supporters’ trusts.

Community: Reorientating clubs to deliver active community engagement.

Northampton Town a now a well-run club which operates within its means. The Trust has the goodwill of the fanbase because they are very well run and highly visible. The Trust are respected by the club and have had direct influence in helping it to become responsible with money and drive its community focus forward.

Just because the FT continually refuse to say how many members they have or be more proactive does not mean that the entire Trust movement is "basically just a few busy bodies" acting with the aim of "gaining some leverage on the local football club". That is just utter, factually inaccurate tripe.


Some of this post was copy-pasted from http://www.ntfctrust.co.uk

My example of Northampton Town was not the best.

I wasn't thinking about NTFC as an example of a Trust influenced club but rather as an example of the size/ status of club that would be potentially 'community' owned.

As far as I'm concerned the FT just postures and is going nowhere. My other point is that if it ever emerged with any influence then this would be against the background of the club being in a sad state. My other point is that anyone with half a brain cell can see that there is a massive polarisation taking place in professional football with an increasing danger that the premier league will be largely a closed shop because only the relegated clubs with their parachute monies will be in a position to invest in players - obviously there will be exceptions to this but the opportunity for clubs like Leicester to gain promotion will be seriously diminished.

LCFC and a few other ambitious clubs are caught in a pincer. On the one hand you have Premier League clubs who are terrified of relegation wanting to do anything to reduce that risk and on the other hand you have the majority of football league clubs that have an interest in reducing spending generally and lvel the playing field within their division.

I acknowledge that there isn't much that can be done about this situation - and it wouldn't surprise me at all if say twenty years on that premier league clubs breakaway and have a relegation proof franchise system....partly on the grounds that they have invested so much this must be protected.

Sadly, we failed to achieve the promotion warranted by all the spending over the past few years and we are paying the price for the failed gamble.

 

[Matt_B]

My example of Northampton Town was not the best.

I wasn't thinking about NTFC as an example of a Trust influenced club but rather as an example of the size/ status of club that would be potentially 'community' owned.

As far as I'm concerned the FT just postures and is going nowhere. My other point is that if it ever emerged with any influence then this would be against the background of the club being in a sad state. My other point is that anyone with half a brain cell can see that there is a massive polarisation taking place in professional football with an increasing danger that the premier league will be largely a closed shop because only the relegated clubs with their parachute monies will be in a position to invest in players - obviously there will be exceptions to this but the opportunity for clubs like Leicester to gain promotion will be seriously diminished.

LCFC and a few other ambitious clubs are caught in a pincer. On the one hand you have Premier League clubs who are terrified of relegation wanting to do anything to reduce that risk and on the other hand you have the majority of football league clubs that have an interest in reducing spending generally and lvel the playing field within their division.

I acknowledge that there isn't much that can be done about this situation - and it wouldn't surprise me at all if say twenty years on that premier league clubs breakaway and have a relegation proof franchise system....partly on the grounds that they have invested so much this must be protected.

Sadly, we failed to achieve the promotion warranted by all the spending over the past few years and we are paying the price for the failed gamble.

I would be surprised if FFP was still in play in 5 years. Once it becomes apparent that the top European club's don't really care about it, the big players will stop coming to the Premier League and they will push through its removal.

 

[consty]

Why the criticism of FT? Can anyone enlighten me?
Generally the trust movement seems a good thing as far as I can see. In the case of LCFC, with rich owners firmly in control, the Leicester turst is bound to be somewhat marginalised, especially (as I think I spotted in one post) the owners seemed to refuse to communicate with them much of the time.
I'd be more inclined to complain about the owners charging £1.2m for 'consultancy/management' fees and 8% for most of their loans (6% for some of them).

 

[bocadillo]

Why the criticism of FT? Can anyone enlighten me?

Did you see the bit in the news yesterday about the 'coalition partners' misappropriating £520,000? They've now paid it to the Treasury where it should have gone in the first place. On the other hand, we have the FT who are still hanging onto the money that they misappropriated.

 

[Redditch Fox]

I would be surprised if FFP was still in play in 5 years. Once it becomes apparent that the top European club's don't really care about it, the big players will stop coming to the Premier League and they will push through its removal.

Quire possibly.

But this won't help the football league clubs. The football league has welcomed the FFP approach and likes it.

If the development you describe takes place then it will just add to the polarisation bewtween the Premier League and the Football League.

In the set up that has applied until now - a club probably has to lose a shed load of money to chase promotion. It's been near impossible to balance the books in the Championship and chase promotion. FFP probably makes the whole system much more sustainable but to someone like me a lot less interesting.