It's time to turn on our owners

[DillyDing22]

Nobody said that anywhere.

Bad decisions have been made. This is true. But all this utter shit about oblivion, financial collapse, blah blah, tin foil helmet tripe is laughable.

If we get relegated then so be it. We won't collapse financially overnight as a result. I don't want us to go down, and I don't think we will but it won't be the end of the ****ing club or the world if we do. KP may have lost a few quid but some on here will have you believe that they've got £12.50 in the bank and a gas bill they can't pay. It's just twoddle and no amount of posting pictures of ostriches will make it any the less daft (cue the inevitable).

Could Top be doing more? Of course. My anger lies more with Whelan and Rudkin though. He needs better advisors and better management around him but the spitting of bile at him and KP just doesn't make any sense. If he wants to sell up and we get new owners then great. If he doesn't and wants to continue then that's equally great. I'm disappointed that the owner hasn't sacked the manager but that's not enough for me to want to him to pack his bags and sell us to some mercenary group with a few more quid in their pocket which is the way of things at the minute.

Football is a funny old game with funny old supporters though. There's a shoestring fry's width between heroes and villains most of the time.

****ing hell I agree with pop.

The window for us turning our PL win into becoming a constant European powerhouse has long gone. It’s a shame we are not ‘the best of the rest’ but we have made bad decisions in many departments.

It’s frustrating that the answer seems so obvious, and the football is so terrible that it is becoming difficult to watch.

Regardless of all that, we are in a better position than we have ever been in;

increased international fan base, beautiful training facilities, a heck of a trophy cabinet and a whole heap of feel good stories and history.
These things won’t disappear overnight and have been built over a decade by one family that have shown they love the club on many occasions.

KP may need a big review on whether the Leicester project is still right for them, but I won’t be turning on them now or in future.

 

[SilverFox]

Once again, for the billionth time, no one is saying all is rosey and no one is saying that inactivity, be that with the manager or incoming transfers, won't lead to things becoming even worse.

But when people post things about us becoming Derby County in the next couple of years, it's ****ing ludicrous.

Why? We are around £280m in debt. It’ll be over £300m this year I expect. Without PL income that debt will increase.

The owners had a group of companies worth 5bn that is now worth 1.5bn. That won’t all be cash. It likely includes LCFC. They haven’t invested for some time. It’s not like they can readily find over £300m (or would want to) to suddenly clear our debt. We are the play thing, not the core business. No one takes a 5th of the core business after most of it has been wiped out to prop up the play thing that continues to generate tens of millions of debt each year.

It may not happen. We may well be fine, KP might well rally now that tourism is returning to Thailand in a significant way. The idea that it is ‘ludicrous’ that we could face similar difficulties to Derby County is sticking your fingers in your ears while humming levels of optimism. It absolutely could happen.

 

[Willlow]

Has he gone yet?

 

[Orifice]

This is a bit like with Ranieri. Yes! He won the league with us!
We cant sack him. Ok, we are stuggling in the league, but we cant sack the manager that just won us the title!

 

[popillius]

Why? We are around £280m in debt. It’ll be over £300m this year I expect. Without PL income that debt will increase.

The owners had a group of companies worth 5bn that is now worth 1.5bn. That won’t all be cash. It likely includes LCFC. They haven’t invested for some time. It’s not like they can readily find over £300m (or would want to) to suddenly clear our debt. We are the play thing, not the core business. No one takes a 5th of the core business after most of it has been wiped out to prop up the play thing that continues to generate tens of millions of debt each year.

It may not happen. We may well be fine, KP might well rally now that tourism is returning to Thailand in a significant way. The idea that it is ‘ludicrous’ that we could face similar difficulties to Derby County is sticking your fingers in your ears while humming levels of optimism. It absolutely could happen.

Well, the numbers you quote are more than likely nonsense. If you have a look at 10 dilfferent so called 'reliable' sources for such information, you get 10 different answers. Secondly, using common sense isn't 'humming levels of optimism'. The age old mistake of suggesting that just because someone doesn't see disaster everywhere they must be happy and optimistic about everything.

 

[popillius]

****ing hell I agree with pop.

Don't worry. A lot of posters feel upset the first time it happens. It'll pass.

 

[Lako42]

Has he gone yet?

Copy and paste for this time next year.

He's never leaving

 

[Joe_Fox]

Of course, there is that slight chance that Top, Whelan, and Rudkin know exactly what they are doing, are all very good at their jobs, and will steer us through this rough patch. I mean, I know a lot of you are absolutely first rate at having opinions, but your not exactly as qualified as the three names I mentioned. It's a long shot that they know better than you, but a shot nonetheless.

 

[SilverFox]

Well, the numbers you quote are more than likely nonsense. If you have a look at 10 dilfferent so called 'reliable' sources for such information, you get 10 different answers. Secondly, using common sense isn't 'humming levels of optimism'. The age old mistake of suggesting that just because someone doesn't see disaster everywhere they must be happy and optimistic about everything.

Well they aren’t nonsense at all. The last set of filed accounts are readily available at companies house as are the secured loans that have been taken out since the accounts were filed in 2021.

This person provides useful summaries of the accounts position which are verifiable by looking at the information in the accounts:-

Thread by @SwissRamble on Thread Reader App

@SwissRamble: Leicester City’s 2020/21 accounts covered “one of the most successful seasons in the club’s history” when they finished 5th in the Premier League, won the FA Cup and reached the last 32 of the Europa...…

threadreaderapp.com

The accounts also record (not factored into the 2021 accounts) that there is further borrowing with Macquarie bank:-



That charge appears to have been registered or or around August 2022. Since then I see a further charge was registered in November with the same bank. This is possibly further borrowing.

The information about KP comes from Forbes.

You point was that it was ‘ludicrous’ that we could face a serious financial problem the scale of Derby County. Use of the term Ludicrous suggests it is so far fetched it is worthy of derision.

I stand by my view it isn’t ludicrous at all.

 

[SilverFox]

 

[Brown Nose]

Well, the numbers you quote are more than likely nonsense. If you have a look at 10 dilfferent so called 'reliable' sources for such information, you get 10 different answers. Secondly, using common sense isn't 'humming levels of optimism'. The age old mistake of suggesting that just because someone doesn't see disaster everywhere they must be happy and optimistic about everything.

Just under a year ago, the club published their debt as being £288m (£267m net). That was for the year to the end of May 2021.

In a few weeks, we'll see the impact of the 21-22 season when the club publish their accounts for that season. Our net spend on players over 21-22 is at least £50m (Daka, Soumare, etc.). The club wage bill was easily the highest ever. We did compete in Europe but bombed out of the Europa League so revenue wouldn't have been as planned. My rough guess is that our losses for 21-22 will be around £70-£80m.

So our losses are then up to approaching £350m. Subsequently, we've stopped giving out contracts to players and we've sold Fofana. That will show up in the 22-23 accounts as a significant profit, although if we finish much lower in the league or get relegated, it will require a full blown fire sale. We spent on Faes and whatever goes out this month too so it may end up not being a profit at all.

To say that the club is not in financial trouble is madness. We're very obviously in a position where relegation would be catastrophic. Far worse than anything we saw in our administration 20 years ago.

The question then is whether King Power will support those losses and effectively bail us out or not. The finances of King Power are much worse than they used to be and not just because of Covid. They are busily selling off asssets such as race horses and polo teams. They've also shrunk their business significantly in Thailand. These are not the actions of an expanding money rich operation.

They also have a much more complex ownership model. The family shares are spread around various members so one person cannot make decisions. Prior to his death, if Vichai wanted to effectively give LCFC money, he could do. Now, if Aiyawatt wanted to, he would need sign off from several other members of his family. That's a massive difference.

All of these factors are relevant. They don't make me feel optimistic.

 

[tedfoxxx]

Don't worry. A lot of posters feel upset the first time it happens. It'll pass.

I feel I might be oversharing this weekend but I had a sex dream about Liz Truss a few months ago. I imagine agreeing with a **** like you is a similar feeling to the one I had when I woke up.

 

[SilverFox]

Also did I miss something?

 

[Brown Nose]

Also did I miss something?

View attachment 17403

https://www.gov.uk/cma-cases/suspec...ster-city-fc-branded-products-and-merchandise

 

[SilverFox]

Of course, there is that slight chance that Top, Whelan, and Rudkin know exactly what they are doing, are all very good at their jobs, and will steer us through this rough patch. I mean, I know a lot of you are absolutely first rate at having opinions, but your not exactly as qualified as the three names I mentioned. It's a long shot that they know better than you, but a shot nonetheless.

I’d say yes Joe, but Brendan Rodgers is still here.

 

[Joe_Fox]

I feel I might be oversharing this weekend but I had a sex dream about Liz Truss a few months ago. I imagine agreeing with a **** like you is a similar feeling to the one I had when I woke up.

Well at least it wasn't the other way round.

 

[tedfoxxx]

Well at least it wasn't the other way round.

Well I’ve certainly never agreed with Liz Truss….

 

[popillius]

Well they aren’t nonsense at all. The last set of filed accounts are readily available at companies house as are the secured loans that have been taken out since the accounts were filed in 2021.

This person provides useful summaries of the accounts position which are verifiable by looking at the information in the accounts:-

Thread by @SwissRamble on Thread Reader App

@SwissRamble: Leicester City’s 2020/21 accounts covered “one of the most successful seasons in the club’s history” when they finished 5th in the Premier League, won the FA Cup and reached the last 32 of the Europa...…

threadreaderapp.com

The accounts also record (not factored into the 2021 accounts) that there is further borrowing with Macquarie bank:-

View attachment 17402

That charge appears to have been registered or or around August 2022. Since then I see a further charge was registered in November with the same bank. This is possibly further borrowing.

The information about KP comes from Forbes.

You point was that it was ‘ludicrous’ that we could face a serious financial problem the scale of Derby County. Use of the term Ludicrous suggests it is so far fetched it is worthy of derision.

I stand by my view it isn’t ludicrous at all.

I wasn't suggesting the published club finances were nonsense. All the other guff about KP and their financial position however, is a combination of some published numbers and a huge amount of hearsay and guesswork. Like I say, you can look ar ten reputable sources and get ten different answers as to their position. Secondly, you have to take into account who the vast majority of our debt is owed to.

It isn't like Derby. Really, not at all.

 

[City Fan]

I wasn't suggesting the published club finances were nonsense. All the other guff about KP and their financial position however, is a combination of some published numbers and a huge amount of hearsay and guesswork. Like I say, you can look ar ten reputable sources and get ten different answers as to their position. Secondly, you have to take into account who the vast majority of our debt is owed to.

It isn't like Derby. Really, not at all.

I hope you’re right Pop I really do, but sadly I don’t think you are. I expressed my concerns a year ago that we’ll be relegated within a couple of years and how we’re pretty much ****ed as a club. I got laughed at then but this last year has played out how I imagined.

But one thing I know for sure is there’s nothing you or I can do about it except watch and see how it all plays out, as painful as it may be. Strap in, it’s going to be bumpy.

 

[Brown Nose]

Another point about them is the lack of communication.

You could argue that they don't have to say anything to fans but I'd strongly disagree. A football club is not a simple private business. We get nothing except banal platitudes from the club. They could remove doubt about their plans and their decision making by setting out their rationale. However we don't get anything. Just the occasional stage-managed article in the programme or website which is utterly worthless.

When was the last time Top, Whelan or Rudkin allowed themselves to be interviewed? Have they ever? I know that multiple journalists have repeatedly asked over the years and they've just been knocked back. The only person that speaks is the manager because he has to. It's pretty unfair on him that he has to answer for every decision that the club makes.

It's just ignorant behaviour. If they don't respect us enough to speak to us, they don't deserve us to also only think the very best of them.