Ched Evans

[ThaiSweetChilli]

I don't know what Steve Bruce is doing because he'll probably regret saying that, even if it is his opinion.

The whole issue of rape is infamously difficult to rule unless there is concrete evidence. It literally is her word against his (or the alternatives).

Clearly the judge and jury have been presented evidence and are in a better position to make a decision than those who weren't in the courtroom however, people are stupid beyond belief. The jury system is flawed because people are flawed and people have pre-conceptions, personal judgements etc. Obviously that doesn't mean that every jury case is wrong, but with something so notoriously difficult to judge such as rape, add a jury full of humans, and we have shaky ground.

How do we know that he didn't walk into the room, she hits on him, and the next day she didn't remember that happening because she was drunk. Maybe morally, Ched should've said "no you're way too drunk" but legally he didn't do anything wrong.

Alternatively how we do know he didn't walk in and force her to have sex? We don't know. IMO, from what I've read based on the crimeline case report, the ruling can hardly be looked at as conclusive or without doubt. Of course that's only based on what I've read on crimeline.

 

[Real Sharapova]

I don't know what Steve Bruce is doing because he'll probably regret saying that, even if it is his opinion.

The whole issue of rape is infamously difficult to rule unless there is concrete evidence. It literally is her word against his (or the alternatives).

Clearly the judge and jury have been presented evidence and are in a better position to make a decision than those who weren't in the courtroom however, people are stupid beyond belief. The jury system is flawed because people are flawed and people have pre-conceptions, personal judgements etc. Obviously that doesn't mean that every jury case is wrong, but with something so notoriously difficult to judge such as rape, add a jury full of humans, and we have shaky ground.

How do we know that he didn't walk into the room, she hits on him, and the next day she didn't remember that happening because she was drunk. Maybe morally, Ched should've said "no you're way too drunk" but legally he didn't do anything wrong.

Alternatively how we do know he didn't walk in and force her to have sex? We don't know. IMO, from what I've read based on the crimeline case report, the ruling can hardly be looked at as conclusive or without doubt. Of course that's only based on what I've read on crimeline.

I think that the other participants evidence would have shed some light on all that. Only guessing.

 

[East Anglia Fox]

I would normally regard myself as taking a relatively hardline in favour of the the alleged victim in rape cases. However, I've found myself drawn into reading a lot of detail about this case now and I find it baffling and disturbing. It seems incomprehensible to me that a verdict of guilty of rape "beyond reasonable doubt" could be delivered on the basis of the evidence, which was virtually non-existent, that a rape actually took place. One can't help but wonder whether the judge (in summing up) and jury were influenced by factors other than evidence, such as the manner of the defendent in the dock. A very tenuous basis for destroying the life and career of a young man. Against my expectations I actually find myself feeling sorry for him. The furore that has been whipped up over his efforts to resume his career seems reminiscent of the witch hunts of less enlightened times.

You've expressed how I feel about this case but in a far more coherent way than I ever could have done. Well done to you.

The last sentence of your post is what terrifies me to the point that I hate being a man, and feel unsure about ever having sex with a woman again in circumstances where either or both parties have consumed alcohol. What is there to stop a woman consenting when drunk and then just saying it's rape at a later date? And what if you were drunk as well, what about your consent and your own judgement?

 

[Macky]

You've expressed how I feel about this case but in a far more coherent way than I ever could have done. Well done to you.

The last sentence of your post is what terrifies me to the point that I hate being a man, and feel unsure about ever having sex with a woman again in circumstances where either or both parties have consumed alcohol. What is there to stop a woman consenting when drunk and then just saying it's rape at a later date? And what if you were drunk as well, what about your consent and your own judgement?

It's all a big conspiracy by the Feminazis to emasculate the male population. We need to stand up erect and fight for the patriarchy

 

[East Anglia Fox]

It's all a big conspiracy by the Feminazis to emasculate the male population. We need to stand up erect and fight for the patriarchy

I'm assuming you're a hetrosexual man and are not a virgin.

Can you confirm that on every occasion you've had sexual intercourse with a woman assessed beforehand whether or not she is in a fit state to consent?

Can you also confirm that, on every single occasion, before you've had sexual intercourse you've got an affirmative "yes" or word of a similar meaning from her allowing you to do so?

If the answer to either of these questions is no, how can you prove you're not a rapist?

 

[RHYDAL]

I'm assuming you're a hetrosexual man and are not a virgin.

Can you confirm that on every occasion you've had sexual intercourse with a woman assessed beforehand whether or not she is in a fit state to consent?

Can you also confirm that, on every single occasion, before you've had sexual intercourse you've got an affirmative "yes" or word of a similar meaning from her allowing you to do so?

If the answer to either of these questions is no, how can you prove you're not a rapist?

Don't try and reason with him. Just smile and wave.

 

[East Anglia Fox]

Don't try and reason with him. Just smile and wave.

Very good advice, actually.

 

[Matt_B]

I'm assuming you're a hetrosexual man and are not a virgin.

Can you confirm that on every occasion you've had sexual intercourse with a woman assessed beforehand whether or not she is in a fit state to consent?

Can you also confirm that, on every single occasion, before you've had sexual intercourse you've got an affirmative "yes" or word of a similar meaning from her allowing you to do so?

If the answer to either of these questions is no, how can you prove you're not a rapist?

Worryingly I'm guessing you haven't?

Would he not have to bother checking if he were gay?

Out of interest, how old are you?

 

[Macky]

I'm assuming you're a hetrosexual man and are not a virgin.

I get whatever I can sweet cheeks, I tend to pounce on whoever smiles and waves in my direction :icon_wink


Why though would it make any difference what my preference is?

 

[pork pie fox]

I get whatever I can sweet cheeks

Slag.

 

[Brown Nose]

Rape is a loathsome, life damaging crime that appears to be committed far too frequently without justice being served. An imbeciles sexual urge, especially when fueled by drugs or alcohol, can be a dangerous thing.

However, that doesn't mean that anyone found guilty of rape is guilty. In this case, a jury has guessed at guilt based on the evidence they heard. This is quite different from most cases of guilt where there is substantial evidence. If I'd been asked to decide the case, I couldn't convict someone in these circumstances. There is absolutely no evidence of a rape having taken place. Even the complainant couldn't say it did.

Whilst I agree with the post made saying what if it were my daughter, I can also think what if that were my son. Evans may well be a total prick but he deserves justice too.

"A complainant consents if, and only if, she has the freedom and capacity to make a choice, and she exercised that choice to agree to sexual intercourse." He said she did, she doesn't recollect. She had consumed around 15 units of alcohol and also had cocaine and cannabis in her system. She had gone to the hotel room with the acquitted defendant of her own free will. Irrespective of anything else, that's a tough case to convict on. Evan's barrister must have been shite.

The nature of sexual crime is usually difficult to prosecute because it takes place in private and is usually witnessed by just two people. I support the legal system tending towards the complainant wherever the case has sufficient evidence, be that a compelling account of events, some evidence of former similar accusations, a dis-credited defence or medical/DNA evidence. This case had none of these. Leicester City could still have three players rotting in jail in La Manga on more evidence than there is in this case.

Of course, this doesn't mean it didn't happen, but it cannot be deemed to have certainly happened. The appeal appears to have been rejected based on non evidence related factors.

On Evan's rehabilitation and right to resume his football career, irrespective of my doubts about the case, I am firmly against him being re-employed unless he clears his name. And I think that of anyone found guilty of any serious crime in any profession that could be deemed to have a public face. By even trying to do this with legal proceedings pending, he's an idiot.

Interesting debate on here though. There appears to be only one person that knows that truth and it boils down to whether you believe him or not.

 

[Matt_B]

Out of interest, he was convicted in 2012; why are some only claiming his innocence/lack of evidence etc now? Is it because he's being refused work? It comes across a bit as though it was ok that (in their eyes) he was wrongly convicted if it only meant jail time but now it means he can't do his chosen career it is a step too far.

 

[David Gwilliam]

Don't try and reason with him. Just smile and wave.

As a grumpy old man I have a deep mistrust of anyone who smiles and waves at me. A nod maybe, a firm handshake perhaps but if you are waving your hands at me you bloody well better be Italian.

 

[Macky]

As a grumpy old man I have a deep mistrust of anyone who smiles and waves at me. A nod maybe, a firm handshake perhaps but if you are waving your hands at me you bloody well better be Italian.

Hahahaha lovely stuff. As a gumpy old bastard middleaged bloke that tries his hardest to still pretend he's a teenager (despite all of the grey hair in my mohican) I just mistrust everybody David. I don't judge people by their handshake, i just don't trust anybody. Full stop.
That East Anglian lad'd get it though if he plays his cards right, wether he likes it or not.
I'm really dunk so I better shut up