Holloway to learn fate on Monday?

[Travelling Fox]

I think that there have been problems with players at this club for years as an example Rab C has just had a 3 year paid holiday on LCFC. I have not always agreed with IH's tactics and I think that he made the mistake of trying to keep us up with people that didn't give a damm e.g Howard, Clapham, et al. We didn't need experience we needed passion (that is why Scum came back from behind twice on the last day) There is a theory that a team gets into a loosing mentality and I think over the past 4 years that has applied to us. Interestingly, over the past few seasons we couldn't sign leaders like Kavanagh, they all decided to go elsewhere.... Why? I don't know. But it would be interesting to know just how much "input?" Mandy has. Perhaps that is why Megson went and why MA was sacked because he told him to feck off out of the team business???
But we are where we are, we now have to clear out all of the dead wood and move forward with young hungry players who want to make a name for themselves. This is the ideal opportunity because for the past few seasons we have had managers that have just been plugging the dyke that has been crumbling for years.
I don't think that IH is the best manager this country has ever seen but I think the humiliation of being the Guy who was in charge of us when we got relegated is one hell of a motivational factor for him to succeed in getting us promoted again. I think that we should be careful what we wish for, unless we can get someone genuinley talented as a manager then we keep what we have for the reasons stated. We must be careful we don't throw out the baby with the bath water.
Oh and by the way I was one of those chuffed when Megson legged it because we were boring, I wonder if he had stayed if we would still be boring but in the championship?....

 

[Mike - True Blue Tinter]

What club in dissarray?

Owner to admit he is no good at football and to stand down as Chairman.

Half decent players cannot be motivated to play well.

Bring in a manager who can motivate them - end of.

 

[alex]

I was thinking that too Travelling, I have a feeling we would be a Champ club still if Ginger Mo' had stayed...

 

[highland fox]

I was thinking that too Travelling, I have a feeling we would be a Champ club still if Ginger Mo' had stayed...

You can get lynched for even suggesting such a thing like that on here

 

[syd]

The pro Ollie argument is ridiculous. All seems influenced by people who either thought he was the saviour and are too stubborn to see sense, or people who just think he's a splendid chap.

Yes the club is unstable, it was when he took the job and said judge me at the end of January. And while we're at it he does statistically have the worst record of any City manager, in his own words, simply because he got us relegated. The points ratio doesn't make it look respectable either.

Not only did he speak consistently like a man hopelessly out of his depth (blaming defeats on playing against ten men and combatting a lack of motivation by saying things like 'we're probably safe now' or 'we've proved our critics wrong'), but he ended up failing miserably. And he's done this before. Twice.

So how do you justify this point of view? Or even the point of view that Mandaric, having given him a very respectable transfer kitty in January (after years of us having boards that make us sell, rather than buy) is the real cancer in our club. Of course he's made some very bad mistakes, but let's not forget we were the ones who didn't want Warnock or Megson. We were the ones tolerating Ollie to the death. He simply didn't consider how best to throw his money at our club.

Plenty of other managers have had to deal with stability and with a lot less money to spend. I can't believe anyone is seriously entertaining the idea that Ollie should stay, or that it was quite understandable that he got us relegated. If City fans have become so sedated that they'll accept Holloway as a suitable way forward, then we deserve the consequences.

 

[Travelling Fox]

You can get lynched for even suggesting such a thing like that on here

Why? for admitting the obvious despite unpalletable it may be?

 

[Melton Fox]

Why? for admitting the obvious despite unpalletable it may be?

Exactly that reason.

 

[alex]

One could also surmise that Ollie had taken on more than he had any idea of, with means to the involvement of MM.....Perhaps players lost respect for IH once they had seen/heard the rows with MM and the obvious tension creeping in.

I still cannot get over losing 3-1 at home to Sheffield Wednesday in front of 30 000+, that was truly unforgivable, yet so predictable.

I have been absolutely disgusted by some of the results our lads have mustered since IH took over, and whilst the blame must end with the manager and chairman, the players themselves must also take responsibility. They won't though, they won't even think about it from their exclusive villa holidays in the Med.

 

[Travelling Fox]

Good post SYD.
My point is that we must get in a manager that is talented. Not just replace IH because he failed. We don't need like for like i.e Dowie etc
We need to be bold and get someone with a future like a Nigel Clough type not "just another manager" if we can't do that then don't change him for the sake of it.! It would be costly and pointless

 

[Heineken Matt]

Good post SYD.
My point is that we must get in a manager that is talented. Not just replace IH because he failed. We don't need like for like i.e Dowie etc
We need to be bold and get someone with a future like a Nigel Clough type not "just another manager" if we can't do that then don't change him for the sake of it.! It would be costly and pointless

Why on earth would we take a gamble on another "up and coming" manager??

Rob Kelly, Gerry Taggert, Craig Levein were all the supposed to be the next big managers in football - and what happened?

 

[Melton Fox]

Why on earth would we take a gamble on another "up and coming" manager??

I agree, if MM decides Holloway has to go, then I want to see a "been there, done that" type of Manager put into place.

 

[4-4-2]

I agree. We haven't faired well with "up and coming managers" in the past so why should be bother with it again after the shit we've had to endure over the past few years.

Peter Taylor, Craig Levein, Martin Allen and Ian Holloway were all supposed to be up and coming. Taylor's been sacked by Stevenage this season, Levein's found his level in the SPL, Allen is still out of a job and Holloway took us down. Great!

 

[OldGit]

I was thinking that too Travelling, I have a feeling we would be a Champ club still if Ginger Mo' had stayed...

I agree. I was not exactly ecstatic about his appointment, but it did make sense. IMO he exemplified exactly what the "stability" argument is really about - he set to work with the dreadful mess he inherited and stabilised a drifting ship. Not pretty, but the players began to look a bit like a team. If he had stayed till January he would then no doubt have been able to build on that. I doubt he would have worked miracles or have been a long-term answer, but would have salvaged the season and provided a basis from which to move forward.

Look what he has done at Bolton, who were at least as chaotic & rudderless as we were, despite losing his only decent striker and having virtually no money.

Whatever the merits or otherwise of IH, he has been there through too much to produce a turn- round. We need another cynical, hard bitten, no-nonsense, probably boring manager at this point. And a couple of players in the same mould.

But don't ask me who!!

 

[highland fox]

I agree. We haven't faired well with "up and coming managers" in the past so why should be bother with it again after the shit we've had to endure over the past few years.

Peter Taylor, Craig Levein, Martin Allen and Ian Holloway were all supposed to be up and coming. Taylor's been sacked by Stevenage this season, Levein's found his level in the SPL, Allen is still out of a job and Holloway took us down. Great!

Levein will be a success down here one day,I guarantee it.He made mistakes here and under estimated the League,he's admitted it and he's learnt friom his mistakes.

 

[4-4-2]

It's an easy question to answer: could it have been any worse if we'd have had Megson in charge? The answer is no.

 

[4-4-2]

Levein will be a success down here one day,I guarantee it.He made mistakes here and under estimated the League,he's admitted it and he's learnt friom his mistakes.

On one of his signings, I think if we'd have had Mark De Vries in the team this season, he wouldn't have given up like Steve Howard (and better quality than Carl Cort) seemed to. He got a lot of flack from fans (wrongly in my opinion) but he was one to never throw in the towel for us. I'd have preferred players like him than some of the gutless tossers we had.

 

[highland fox]

I agree. I was not exactly ecstatic about his appointment, but it did make sense. IMO he exemplified exactly what the "stability" argument is really about - he set to work with the dreadful mess he inherited and stabilised a drifting ship. Not pretty, but the players began to look a bit like a team. If he had stayed till January he would then no doubt have been able to build on that. I doubt he would have worked miracles or have been a long-term answer, but would have salvaged the season and provided a basis from which to move forward.

Look what he has done at Bolton, who were at least as chaotic & rudderless as we were, despite losing his only decent striker and having virtually no money.

Whatever the merits or otherwise of IH, he has been there through too much to produce a turn- round. We need another cynical, hard bitten, no-nonsense, probably boring manager at this point. And a couple of players in the same mould.

But don't ask me who!!

Spot on

 

[syd]

Was Rob Kelly ever meant to be one of the best up and coming managers? Or Taggart? Would we have gone down had he been allowed to continue with Burrrows? Surely reappointing him would represent stability, if that's such a priority...

A good young manager is not necessarily a dangerous choice. It worked three times consecutively in the 90s and one could argue that Kelly had some degree of success, saving us from relegation in '06 and keeping heads above water during the takeover without any money to spend. Neither Megson nor Allen stayed long enough to make an impact while Micky Adams (younger than all of the aforementioned) was our best manager since O'Neill.

Only Holloway and Levein have been miserable failures. Levein was a gamble, having had no experience of English football and with the club allowing him to dismiss the director of football. He had no money and, it should be remembered, did halve the wage bill and simultaneously knock 5 years off the squad's average age.

Peter Taylor was 46 when he took over, hardly inexperienced. Holloway at 44 had already managed three clubs in this league (relegating two of them). In his case he was quite simply a crazy choice for a club in 17th position. It's not a matter of whether or not we should appoint young managers, we've had poor experienced managers too (Bassett was hardly a storming success, ditto Pleat).

 

[highland fox]

If Holloway is to go (which I now doubt) I think Newell is the best replacement

 

[Melton Fox]

while Micky Adams (younger than all of the aforementioned) was our best manager since O'Neill

Aye, but only relatively speaking.

At the time, we realised he was shite and wanted him out. There were even mild protests if I remember correctly.

He's only the best Manager since MON by default.