Barack Obama

[Biff]

The people vote and pick the candidate. Who do you think picks the candidates ?. The same people that have been picking and funding Presidents for decades. They make the decisions.

 

[Boy Genius]

I'm not surprised by the general reaction on here, knowing as I do now that the standard British opinion is one liberally soaked in institutionalized cynicism and apathy. I used to be saddled with that terrible burden as well until I moved to the States and started to open my mind up a little...

Over here we are quite excited that a genuine change of direction for America, and probably because of it the world at large, could be on the way. I suppose the attitude I have now is the cheesy "yes we can", but it does make for a happier, more fulfilling life. You should try it!

But I guess you'll all simply dismiss that as naive, in the standard cynical British way. And that's fair enough - you're entitled to your overwhelming negativity...

DF it's the same old hype in the USA every time there is a new President elected, it's going to be a better world, a better USA, a better Commander in Chief as before.
The reality is there never is a change, everything is the same old same old. Nothing changes. The USA will still continue to trot around the world flexing its muscles, threatening smaller countries if it does not agree with what they are doing etc etc. The worst thing is, it seems to expect the UK to be at its side all the time.

 

[FIF]

I think that USA MUST change. their empire is on a downward slide which will end in them becoming a minor power (without use of force) before the end of the century

 

[Biff]

DF it's the same old hype in the USA every time there is a new President elected, it's going to be a better world, a better USA, a better Commander in Chief as before.The reality is there never is a change, everything is the same old same old. Nothing changes. The USA will still continue to trot around the world flexing its muscles, threatening smaller countries if it does not agree with what they are doing etc etc. The worst thing is, it seems to expect the UK to be at its side all the time.

Its called being brainwashed.

 

[Macky]

DF it's the same old hype in the USA every time there is a new President elected, it's going to be a better world, a better USA, a better Commander in Chief as before.
The reality is there never is a change, everything is the same old same old. Nothing changes. The USA will still continue to trot around the world flexing its muscles, threatening smaller countries if it does not agree with what they are doing etc etc. The worst thing is, it seems to expect the UK to be at its side all the time.

The UK aren't actually always the lapdogs to the Yanks as often portrayed, they are just as likely to be driving the global fascist policies.

 

[londonfox]

If somebody could outline what 'change' might possibly entail, then I might give it some consideration.

My cynicism isn't baseless, the ridiculous emotional hype is.

Well said Macky... I need to know what is behind the soundbyte before I will start whooping and hollering and gushing ecstatic floods of tears over the great period that is about to engulf the country that I live in.

I think that USA MUST change. their empire is on a downward slide which will end in them becoming a minor power (without use of force) before the end of the century

Yeah... I don't see the USA ever being anything other than a Superpower.

 

[FIF]

Well said Macky... I need to know what is behind the soundbyte before I will start whooping and hollering and gushing ecstatic floods of tears over the great period that is about to engulf the country that I live in.



Yeah... I don't see the USA ever being anything other than a Superpower.

Open your eyes. China is already moving ahead of the U.S., Europe is getting its act together too, India are fast advancing.

Bush was fiddling while the US burned.

 

[drummindefender]

DF it's the same old hype in the USA every time there is a new President elected, it's going to be a better world, a better USA, a better Commander in Chief as before.
The reality is there never is a change, everything is the same old same old. Nothing changes. The USA will still continue to trot around the world flexing its muscles, threatening smaller countries if it does not agree with what they are doing etc etc. The worst thing is, it seems to expect the UK to be at its side all the time.

Bollocks. Your saying theres no difference between the Bush Administration and previous governments!?

 

[londonfox]

Open your eyes. China is already moving ahead of the U.S., Europe is getting its act together too, India are fast advancing.

Bush was fiddling while the US burned.

O.K. I guess we have a different perspective on this. Whilst I agree with you that China, and to a much lesser and slower extent, India are both growing economies, I don't think their growth will ever diminish the USA to a second-rate power. They may join the US at the superpower table but they wil lnever knock them off it.

The worst thing is, it seems to expect the UK to be at its side all the time.

I don't think the US expects anything for the UK. Let's be honest, as much as everyone in Britain would like to think that have major political influence on the world, the reality is that the US doesn't need the UK for anything. I'm not saying they do not welcome their help but they do not need them. The US will do what the US wants to do whether Westminster approves or not.

 

[drummindefender]

O.K. I guess we have a different perspective on this. Whilst I agree with you that China, and to a much lesser and slower extent, India are both growing economies, I don't think their growth will ever diminish the USA to a second-rate power. They may join the US at the superpower table but they wil lnever knock them off it.



I don't think the US expects anything for the UK. Let's be honest, as much as everyone in Britain would like to think that have major political influence on the world, the reality is that the US doesn't need the UK for anything. I'm not saying they do not welcome their help but they do not need them. The US will do what the US wants to do whether Westminster approves or not.

Spot on

 

[Boy Genius]

Bollocks. Your saying theres no difference between the Bush Administration and previous governments!?

Did I say that?
I can remember back to lot of USA elections, and after every each one there is always this hype. It always fizzles out and melts into the same. All this ****ing hype is nothing new.

 

[FIF]

O.K. I guess we have a different perspective on this. Whilst I agree with you that China, and to a much lesser and slower extent, India are both growing economies, I don't think their growth will ever diminish the USA to a second-rate power. They may join the US at the superpower table but they wil lnever knock them off it.

I'm talking about being an economic super power. Look at their industries, especially that mammoth automobile industry, 50 years and we'll see the signs. 10 years and china will have pulled away, 20 and India will have too. Europe will overtake them too, america are not as flexible as they think they are, the OLD europeans are flexible, we face reality better.

They benefitted from the war (WW2) as other countries had to plough money into rebuilding, but they are now ageing. They benefitted from having a relatively big population which was willing to work cheaply but their size and competitivity is nothing compared to the likes of China and India now.

Of course the US will remain a "superpower" as far as armament is concerned and therein lies the biggest problem, can they resist from using it as their economic power slips.

but your right, it's just my personal view of things to come.

 

[drummindefender]

Did I say that?
I can remember back to lot of USA elections, and after every each one there is always this hype. It always fizzles out and melts into the same. All this ****ing hype is nothing new.

I don't remember this much hype after the last two elections, obviously i can't really comment much further back then that tho' grandad :icon_wink

 

[Boy Genius]

I don't remember this much hype after the last two elections, obviously i can't really comment much further back then that tho' grandad :icon_wink

I know a fair bit about the ****ing bible, but I wasn't around then you stupid ****!....:icon_wink

 

[City Fan]

I don't remember this much hype after the last two elections, obviously i can't really comment much further back then that tho' grandad :icon_wink

I vaguelly remember some hype quite a few years ago when I think it was George Bush v Al Gore. That's as far back as I remember.

 

[FIF]

peanuts

 

[Melton Fox]

I love it when bollocks gets spouted.

We are ALL clueless about the plans of the American government, Iranian government, UK Government etc etc.

We are all clueless, everyone of us, but it's the morons that can't admit it. Ultimately resulting in them being branded "Clueless Morons".

I reckon that there might have been some "Clueless Morons" spouting shit in this thread, but I may be wrong.

 

[DesertFox]

I think that sums it up well Melts. Nobody has got a clue whether Obama will be able to deliver or not.

I'm optimistic that he can. And if it ends in disappointment and nothing changes? Will I be able to cope with the disappointment? Oh no! :icon_roll

The alternative is to assume that nothing is going to change and we're all going to hell in a handcart regardless, and spend my days under a self-perpetuating cloud. So I think I'll go glass half full on this one and deal with any potential disappointments as best I can.

Oh, and seriously, anyone who can't tell the difference politically between the current regime and Obama's stated aims is either incredibly stupid, or just on a wind up mission (Macky:icon_wink).

If you aren't prepared to take Obama (or anyone else for that matter) at face value to at least some extent, then the only "evidence" that will satisfy you is whether or not he actually delivers on his stated aims. Which makes having this discussion redundant for the next four or eight years, or as you all seem to think, until he gets shot.

 

[drummindefender]

I think that sums it up well Melts. Nobody has got a clue whether Obama will be able to deliver or not.

I'm optimistic that he can. And if it ends in disappointment and nothing changes? Will I be able to cope with the disappointment? Oh no! :icon_roll

The alternative is to assume that nothing is going to change and we're all going to hell in a handcart regardless, and spend my days under a self-perpetuating cloud. So I think I'll go glass half full on this one and deal with any potential disappointments as best I can.

Oh, and seriously, anyone who can't tell the difference politically between the current regime and Obama's stated aims is either incredibly stupid, or just on a wind up mission (Macky:icon_wink).

If you aren't prepared to take Obama (or anyone else for that matter) at face value to at least some extent, then the only "evidence" that will satisfy you is whether or not he actually delivers on his stated aims. Which makes having this discussion redundant for the next four or eight years, or as you all seem to think, until he gets shot.

Couldn't have put it better myself DF. Plus your a clueless moron imo for not reading a thread and then arguing based on your assumptions. I'm pretty optimistic no military conflict with Iran will happen with Obama in charge, but doesn't mean it won't.

 

[Cate Fox]

I'd like to think he will make a difference, he can certainly talk the talk.... but can he walk the walk ??