pork pie fox
Well-Known Member
I was pretty certain, too, so I put £40 on it. My normal bets are for about £5 a time, so it was a lot for me. I, like you, was convinced that was what would happen.
General Election June 8th
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David Gwilliam
Well-Known Member
Oh dear!
No doubt people had many reasons for voting Remain or Leave. I voted Brexit over national sovereignty. I voted Remain in 1975 and would have supported the EU if it had continued to be a purely economic organisation.
Your views on foreigners seem rather unsavoury. My concern is that bigots in the Bremain camp might see them as in some way representing the Brexit viewpoint.
fitz
Well-Known Member
Sadly David, the leave voters who based their vote on their dislike of foreigners have been much more vocal than the likes of yourself. I can count on one hand how many people I know personally voted leave for reasons other than xenophobia. there'll be more that but won't admit it as so many are screaming about immigants and bears.
There are a few reasons why I didn't want May's Conservatives to win and none of them have anything to do with her being a woman.
1) she was doubling down on austerity at a time when we need to loosen the purse strings a bit to see us through Brexit
2) she called an election for the wrong reasons, she had no interest in a true democratic process and was instead trying to capitalise on the opposition's perceived weakness to force a fake 'mandate' for a hard Brexit, ultimately for her own personal gain. Nobody should expect to be able to play tricks like that on the British public and get away with it.
3) she treated the electorate with further contempt by assuming she had a majority in the bag and largely refusing to engage in the campaigning. If you can't be bothered to even try to convince me you should be prime minister then you're not getting my vote.
4) where she did put forward worthwhile policy she U-turned under the slightest amount of pressure
5) in the seven years the Tories have been in power they've consistently missed target after target, which demonstrates a level of incompetence which we shouldn't just accept out of tribal faith in our preferred party
6) similarly, in the same period other comparable countries have performed much better across a whole range of measures despite facing similar challenges, which further evidences Tory failures
7) I have never been socially conservative anyway, if money were no object I'd vote for a left wing party all the time
8) I don't think much to Corbyn or his policies but in reality they would have been watered down had he got into power, which would have got us closer to where I think we need to be than will May and whatever ugly little coalition she conjures up with the gypsy terrorists
Even today May's incompetence shines bright as she goes bounding into a meeting with the queen in a mad rushed power grab to set up a dodgy coalition, where she evidently hasn't spent more than a minute properly considering the potential ramifications it might have on the fragile peace in NI. Does she care? Does she ****. The woman is a joke.
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Brown Nose
Well-Known Member
I always stay up to watch the general election coverage. This time round was the first time I've stayed awake all through the night. It was fascinating stuff.
I think that this election will go down as the year that people finally understood tactical voting. The swings were randomised in neighbouring constituencies. It was impressive stuff by our electorate. Especially the younger voters that came out in numbers at last.
However, the outcome is frustrating to say the least. The worst election campaign in history and May still wins by 50 seats and increases the Conservative share of the vote. Whether she's propped up by Irish loonies or soon to be ambushed and replaced by an even bigger Tory loon, we're stuck with them for the foreseeable future.
I don't understand the jubilation from Labour. They're still a long way from power. And without power, what's the point of politics? Corbyn did okay. It was a better campaign than the last couple from Labour but that's not hard. I still refuse to believe that enough people will ever vote for him to enable him to become Prime Minister. He'd be much better off restructuring his shadow cabinet and getting some talent into it. Ditching the useless Abbott etc. If he's such a believer in the young, he needs to promote it.
I think that this election will go down as the year that people finally understood tactical voting. The swings were randomised in neighbouring constituencies. It was impressive stuff by our electorate. Especially the younger voters that came out in numbers at last.
However, the outcome is frustrating to say the least. The worst election campaign in history and May still wins by 50 seats and increases the Conservative share of the vote. Whether she's propped up by Irish loonies or soon to be ambushed and replaced by an even bigger Tory loon, we're stuck with them for the foreseeable future.
I don't understand the jubilation from Labour. They're still a long way from power. And without power, what's the point of politics? Corbyn did okay. It was a better campaign than the last couple from Labour but that's not hard. I still refuse to believe that enough people will ever vote for him to enable him to become Prime Minister. He'd be much better off restructuring his shadow cabinet and getting some talent into it. Ditching the useless Abbott etc. If he's such a believer in the young, he needs to promote it.
bocadillo
Water Gypsy
He can't do that while she's still got the photographs.
David Gwilliam
Well-Known Member
Perhaps the real story of the election is the failure of the Labour Party but I want to concentrate on the Conservatives - who did badly but not as badly as Labour.
There are many clichés in politics and two are "Same Old Labour" and "Same Old Tories". "Same old Labour" is the accusation that they are economically incompetent. "Same Old Tories" is the accusation that the Conservatives are heartless. (Leave aside that the Tory Party ended in the 1840s)
Leaders do well when they break the "same old" which is why Wilson and Blair were election winners. Mrs May was doing well in the polls when she talked about "the just about managing". Her mistake came from having a manifesto that played into "the same old Tories" slogan. She is an able performer in the formal setting of the Commons but she is not a natural election campaigner. Great election winners like Macmillan and Wilson really liked people - Blair appeared to like people but the historical jury is out on him. (The greatest exponents of this were Franklin Roosevelt and Ronald Reagan).
When Prime Minister's make a major blunder it destroys them. Neville Chamberlain and Anthony Eden were brilliant politicians but Munich and Suez destroyed them. History is a poor guide to the future but my guess is that Mrs May will not recover.
The Conservatives can take comfort in two things. They are fighting back in Scotland and they seem to be facing the fact they are in a mess - while Labour (where my heart is) have completely misunderstood the election.
There are many clichés in politics and two are "Same Old Labour" and "Same Old Tories". "Same old Labour" is the accusation that they are economically incompetent. "Same Old Tories" is the accusation that the Conservatives are heartless. (Leave aside that the Tory Party ended in the 1840s)
Leaders do well when they break the "same old" which is why Wilson and Blair were election winners. Mrs May was doing well in the polls when she talked about "the just about managing". Her mistake came from having a manifesto that played into "the same old Tories" slogan. She is an able performer in the formal setting of the Commons but she is not a natural election campaigner. Great election winners like Macmillan and Wilson really liked people - Blair appeared to like people but the historical jury is out on him. (The greatest exponents of this were Franklin Roosevelt and Ronald Reagan).
When Prime Minister's make a major blunder it destroys them. Neville Chamberlain and Anthony Eden were brilliant politicians but Munich and Suez destroyed them. History is a poor guide to the future but my guess is that Mrs May will not recover.
The Conservatives can take comfort in two things. They are fighting back in Scotland and they seem to be facing the fact they are in a mess - while Labour (where my heart is) have completely misunderstood the election.
Motown Fox
Well-Known Member
A Lib/Lab/SNP Alliance would have made an interesting Government 
FIF
Well-Known Member
A Lib/Lab/SNP Alliance would have made an interesting Government
Would the Alliance party have agreed?
FIF
Well-Known Member
They do under the PR table above.
Blue Maniac
Alzheimers sufferer
FIF
Well-Known Member
Who cares?
whoosh.
Blue Maniac
Alzheimers sufferer
FIF
Well-Known Member
sorry.
David Gwilliam
Well-Known Member
What has happened to pork pie fox? A wise and venerable member has suddenly lost form - like Mahrez on a bad day.
It is counterproductive to criticise other peoples intelligence while using adolescent language.
No wonder you found it tricky. He was right. A considerable number of Asians were driven out of Uganda in the 1970s. I know we live in a society where too few people have any understanding of events before 1914 but the 1970s ,PPF, surely you must know about the 1970s.
An interesting post. Obviously there are too many right wing bigots who are racist. Equally there are too many left wing bigots who regard any concerns about multiculture or immigration as racist.
What BM should you say if you are not a racist but are accused by some Guardian version of Mr Dick (1) of being racist.
(1) Mr Dick is an obsessive character in David Copperfield. Whatever the subject he brings the subject round to King Charles head. Dickens would have written wonderfully on the bigots of left and right.
It is counterproductive to criticise other peoples intelligence while using adolescent language.
Trying to explain that the fact that Uganda wasn't in Asia, and therefore that their issue with "Ugandan Asians" probably wasn't the greatest theory, is a tricky one
No wonder you found it tricky. He was right. A considerable number of Asians were driven out of Uganda in the 1970s. I know we live in a society where too few people have any understanding of events before 1914 but the 1970s ,PPF, surely you must know about the 1970s.
An interesting post. Obviously there are too many right wing bigots who are racist. Equally there are too many left wing bigots who regard any concerns about multiculture or immigration as racist.
What BM should you say if you are not a racist but are accused by some Guardian version of Mr Dick (1) of being racist.
(1) Mr Dick is an obsessive character in David Copperfield. Whatever the subject he brings the subject round to King Charles head. Dickens would have written wonderfully on the bigots of left and right.
pork pie fox
Well-Known Member
Answers:
1) I didn't use that language with him. I just didn't engage.
2) I was unaware of that, until Jeff pointed it out. I wasn't born until '76, so it was before my time.
I fear you have made a fatal assumption, Mr G. Wise
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