MM "Promotion THIS season..."

[Jeff]

Isn't it better to go up and stay up?

Of course it is. But the longer it takes to get up, the more difficult it will be to stay there.

If we try to build a team over the long term, we're likely to end up falling further behind the Premiership because of all the extra money they now have.

Any time we have a player who is obviously Premiership quality we'll end up selling him. Don't say it won't happen with MM in charge - he sold Crouch when he was at Portsmouth.

 

[Mike - True Blue Tinter]

As a buisness plan this is not sustainable. Even with the parachute payments. I would prefer steady growth and a good infrastructure. Good quality players are more likely to be attracted to us that way than to a club that is likely to yo yo.

I would like promotion this season though.... be nice!

Promotion year = £30million + 2 yrs Parachute = £20million. Total over 3 years = £50million. All players contracts are pro-rata for the division you are in. It is a very sustainable business plan! That is why MM wants to get up as soon as possible.

 

[consty]

Of course it is. But the longer it takes to get up, the more difficult it will be to stay there.

If we try to build a team over the long term, we're likely to end up falling further behind the Premiership because of all the extra money they now have.

Any time we have a player who is obviously Premiership quality we'll end up selling him. Don't say it won't happen with MM in charge - he sold Crouch when he was at Portsmouth.

Whilst I still side with the 'build it in 2 years not one' camp this undoubtedly is another fair point to throw into the debate.... if the team is NOT promoted this season it is a fair bet that the best players - say Kinsboro, McCauley, Clemence & Weslowski (+ Campbell if he scores 20 goals) will all be sold (not because MM wants to sell them but because when a premier team comes in, most players insist on going). Thus MM and the manager not only have the expected task of adding say 2 players to build on a promotion push the next season but 4 more on top of that(!) to replace the guys that have gone.

Jeff, your points are pretty persuasive. My position has wavered a bit!

 

[Jedi]

Of course it is. But the longer it takes to get up, the more difficult it will be to stay there.

If we try to build a team over the long term, we're likely to end up falling further behind the Premiership because of all the extra money they now have.

Any time we have a player who is obviously Premiership quality we'll end up selling him. Don't say it won't happen with MM in charge - he sold Crouch when he was at Portsmouth.

It's a double edged sword. If we try an buy a quick fix and get promoted and the subsequently relegated we are only slightly better position than we are in now. We will become a revolving door for Managers and players.

I think the squad we have is as capable as any other in the league for getting promoted. Buying expensive old players doesn't guarantee anything.

 

[Mike - True Blue Tinter]

It's a double edged sword. If we try an buy a quick fix and get promoted and the subsequently relegated we are only slightly better position than we are in now. We will become a revolving door for Managers and players.

I think the squad we have is as capable as any other in the league for getting promoted. Buying expensive old players doesn't guarantee anything.

You regard £50million as being in only a slightly better position than now?!

 

[Dogbreath]

We've been down the path of buying promotion with older players before, it didn't work. I agree that the money is the major thing here and that the longer we take to get there the harder it will be to stay there but, I would much rather see a team built up over a couple of years and then strengthened by the premiership money to help us stay there than go through the heartache of going down the Walkers and seeing us getting beaten week in week out again. The relegation seasons were not happy ones

The Bottom line though is its Mandys train set and he'll do what he wants with it.

At least when he gets us there we'll have bragging rights over the covscum and trees :icon_bigg

 

[OldGit]

You regard £50million as being in only a slightly better position than now?!

Much of that would probably be spent/committed.

But the real "what if" with either strategy concerns NOT getting promoted at the target time.

 

[Jedi]

Much of that would probably be spent/committed.

But the real "what if" with either strategy concerns NOT getting promoted at the target time.

Absolutely! If we are to get promoted obviously the sooner the better. But £50m doesn't go very far these days in the Prems especially when every club has the same or even more! I admire Milan's vision just not sure the way he wants to get there is the right way.

 

[SJN-Fox]

I can't be bothered to trawl through all of this, so forgive me if I'm just repeating what has already been written, however, I don't recall MM saying he wanted promotion in 3 years, IIRC, what he said was that if we haven't achieved promotion inside 3 years he will see this as failure.

Some people seem to be reading this as saying that he's looking for promotion as part of a 3 year plan. He wants promotion this season, he wants to start maximising his investment at the earliest opportunity. Why else has he said all along that he wants to be in the top 6 at Christmas.

There is no 3 year plan. He wants promotion this time round and will brook no interference in that aim.

 

[Jeff]

We've been down the path of buying promotion with older players before, it didn't work.

What we did before was sign a lot of older players who weren't good enough.

If we can get a good mix of young players and some quality experienced players with enough years left in them to do a job in the Premiership we may be able to go up and stay there. But signing old players who are past it just because they were once a good Premiership player is a waste of money.

 

[SilverFox]

Well we won't be going up by dispensing with managers at our current rate.

Nor will we be going up with the current signings and the thrilling addition of that portugese bloke.

Whoever he is.

 

[PFKAKTF FOX]

Fecking right we should be aiming for promotion this season, FFS Derby did last year so why shouldn't we aim for the same.

Oh and by the way I think there has been a fairly decent mix of signings this season. Granted N'Gotty, Newton and Kish are older, Clemence, Frierra and Campbell have plenty of years ahead of them and Kaebi is relatively young so just on that instance a fairly balanced crop of signings.

The truth is Milan identified players like JFH and Fowler as Premier League legends and at their ages would prove to be short term successes in the championship from both a playing and commercial aspect. Milan wants quality and it appears to me that he is looking to follow the Pompey blueprint, which has worked well.

As for MA, IMO Milan hired him probably based on MA's initially infectious personality and his ability to play the audience, lets be honest many have been suckered in by his ability to "Say the right things" and "talk a good game" only to realise almost straight away that he had actually employed somebody who was woefully out of his depth and a fecking PR disaster waiting to happen.

 

[Boy Genius]

Fecking right we should be aiming for promotion this season, FFS Derby did last year so why shouldn't we aim for the same.

Oh and by the way I think there has been a fairly decent mix of signings this season. Granted N'Gotty, Newton and Kish are older, Clemence, Frierra and Campbell have plenty of years ahead of them and Kaebi is relatively young so just on that instance a fairly balanced crop of signings.

The truth is Milan identified players like JFH and Fowler as Premier League legends and at their ages would prove to be short term successes in the championship from both a playing and commercial aspect. Milan wants quality and it appears to me that he is looking to follow the Pompey blueprint, which has worked well.

As for MA, IMO Milan hired him probably based on MA's initially infectious personality and his ability to play the audience, lets be honest many have been suckered in by his ability to "Say the right things" and "talk a good game" only to realise almost straight away that he had actually employed somebody who was woefully out of his depth and a fecking PR disaster waiting to happen.

the squad is much more balanced than it was last season, and the standard of the players is a lot higher. I would think any good manager would be able to work with our squad without any problems at all. We saw what they were capable of against Watford

 

[Redditch Fox]

Some people seem to be reading this as saying that he's looking for promotion as part of a 3 year plan. He wants promotion this season, he wants to start maximising his investment at the earliest opportunity. Why else has he said all along that he wants to be in the top 6 at Christmas.

There is no 3 year plan. He wants promotion this time round and will brook no interference in that aim.

Obviously, Milan is of an age where he is in a hurry. He was never going to put up with a manager who was in for a steady build up.

Promotion gives him options as to whether to sell or hang on.

Its hardly rocket science. We are lucky to have Milan because before his arrival the club was a virtual corpse,but he is sure to be looking at his next strategy.

 

[Brown Nose]

I've never understood the 'build a team steadily' argument. You get promotion however you can and then fight like hell to stay there. End of story.

MM wanting promotion asap is a no-brainer. Of course he does. He's here for the money and the money is only in one place.

But it's totally irrelevant whether the average age of your squad is 18 or 35. Or whether it's done with names or unknowns or Englishmen or foreigners. It's just about winning 25+ matches out of 46. There is no proven recipe for doing that. Teams have got promoted in all manner of ways.

Just another reason why I cannot get the sacking. How does MM know that a currently unknown other person has a better chance of getting us promotion this year than MA? The fans sure as hell don't know that. So what does MM know? And what possible reason could he have for choosing to keep quiet about it?

I don't think there is one. Which is why I believe our clubs owner is a total loony.

 

[Mike - True Blue Tinter]

Just another reason why I cannot get the sacking. How does MM know that a currently unknown other person has a better chance of getting us promotion this year than MA? The fans sure as hell don't know that. So what does MM know? And what possible reason could he have for choosing to keep quiet about it?

I don't think there is one. Which is why I believe our clubs owner is a total loony.

From all the 'leaks' it may be MA got sacked because of his methods all over the club, not just what he wanted to do with the first team.

 

[Beliall]

very interesting read, but maybe unwise of MM to pile a lot of pressure on the future manger, whoever he maybe. it would be nice to get promoted this season, but after all the evnts, the take-over, the re-vamp, new chairman, managers , team, i cant seeit happening without sir alez ferguson at the helm.

 

[Redditch Fox]

i cant seeit happening without sir alez ferguson at the helm.

I don't agree - I would greatly prefer Sir Alex Ferguson myself. Not sure about the track record of Sir Alez.

 

[consty]

...
.....But it's totally irrelevant whether the average age of your squad is 18 or 35. ... It's just about winning 25+ matches out of 46. There is no proven recipe for doing that. Teams have got promoted in all manner of ways.

Just another reason why I cannot get the sacking. How does MM know that a currently unknown other person has a better chance of getting us promotion this year than MA?...Which is why I believe our clubs owner is a total loony.

Originally Posted by PFKAKTF FOX
....The truth is Milan identified players like JFH and Fowler as Premier League legends and at their ages would prove to be short term successes in the championship from both a playing and commercial aspect. Milan wants quality and it appears to me that he is looking to follow the Pompey blueprint which has worked well.


I think PFox answers Brown Nose here & its what I said at the beginning of the thread... MM believes the way to gain promotion this season (which is his clear aim) without an Abromovich type budget (which he is certainly not prepared to fund), is to draft in old premiership players or similar from abroad on free transfers in the hope that they've still got some gas in the tank left for a season. It is exactly as PF says, 'the Pompey blueprint.' His belief is adding them to the best players LCFC had in the squad already and maybe buying just the odd young gun is what will achieve promotion in minimum time, at mininum cost. My only question to PF and everyone else on here, is how do you know that "<they>would prove to be short term successes.." If MM presses his managers to sign, say 2 or 3 'legends' on top wages what do you do if they all prove to be 'washed up'. What if RF & JFH had been signed and a 'midfield legend' as well all of whom flopped? How do you know in advance AND what would MM do to rectify it? Would he go back in the next transfer window and pay another million apiece in wages on 3 more? The manager certainly pay the pay the price and be dismissed for sure, but would he get any more players in?

 

[The Old Fox]

As far as the argument for old players to get us up goes; isn't it interesting that Cardiff started, yesterday, with Fowler & JFH but took an "ineffective Fowler" off for a younger player, who scored one and set one up (not for JFH) & won the game?