Post Match Doncaster 2-1 Leicester

[Profondo Rosso]

The Brown/Bamba discussion doesn't seem entirely fair to me as Brown played behind a team of players who tried to work as a unit. Countless times our central defenders have had to deal with one on ones as the midfield stand and watch, I think they've dug us out of the shit plenty times in similar situations Brown was often found back peddling, fact is it was a rare circumstance for him to have to deal with.

Brown played behind virtually the same midfield as Bamba though. Unless you think Matt Oakley was doing a really underrated job in there (which could be quite an interesting point actually)?

 

[fitz]

Brown played behind virtually the same midfield as Bamba. Unless Matt Oakley was doing a really underrated job in there?

Well observed, would you claim they play the same way though?

 

[Profondo Rosso]

Well observed, would you claim they play the same way though?

Wellens, Dyer and Gallagher, absolutely. I don't remember any of those players ever particularly being great at tracking back or helping out the defence.

King, no. Under NP first time round he was employed as a defensive midfielder and was largely actually seen dropping back to form a defensive line of 5 when the opposition had the ball. SGE always played him as a more attacking midfielder. He is starting to do this a lot more since NP came back though, especially against Blackpool.

 

[Profondo Rosso]

One other thing that could be a reason that our defence wasn't as good as in 09/10 is that Peltier and Konchesky attack a lot more than Morrison and Berner did, because SGE brought in attacking full-backs to try and provide width from his narrow midfield, whereas NP prefers to have width from wide midfield players and have defensive full-backs.

I know one or two have suggested we've been conceding too many goals from crosses/our full-backs positions recently. Maybe we need more defensive minded full-backs, along with better wingers.

 

[fitz]

Wellens, Dyer and Gallagher, absolutely. I don't remember any of those players ever particularly being great at tracking back or helping out the defence.

King, no. Under NP first time round he was employed as a defensive midfielder and was largely actually seen dropping back to form a defensive line of 5 when the opposition had the ball. SGE always played him as a more attacking midfielder. He is starting to do this a lot more since NP came back though, especially against Blackpool.

Ture, perhaps if we had someone playing the role king or Oakley did that season then defence wouldn't be such an issue for you? Which would suggest a lot is down to our midfield playing shite this season.

Add to that the comparison between Berner and Konch, there's been loads of occasions where Konch has had to deal (or try to) with players running at him as the last man, Berner did most of his work on the touchline closing down players looking to get the ball from a player under pressure. There is much less presure on players and more space as there is no longer a team playing as a unit. Hopefully this is something we can get back to.

 

[Profondo Rosso]

Ture, perhaps if we had someone playing the role king or Oakley did that season then defence wouldn't be such an issue for you? Which would suggest a lot is down to our midfield playing shite this season.

Add to that the comparison between Berner and Konch, there's been loads of occasions where Konch has had to deal (or try to) with players running at him as the last man, Berner did most of his work on the touchline closing down players looking to get the ball from a player under pressure. There is much less presure on players and more space as there is no longer a team playing as a unit. Hopefully this is something we can get back to.

I get what you're saying fitz and I while I agree that the midfield could help out more defensively, the defence still has to do it's job when there and I think Bamba, St. Ledger and Mills have all been too inconsistent for me and with better defenders and defenders who can organise both themselves and their team mates better, which I feel we can quite reasonably attain with a bit of scouting know how, we could still have been much better defensively regardless of the changes in midfield imo.

There is also the question as to why you feel some midfielders (King) are not doing the same job if they are the same players, that may well be down to not have a good leader behind them organising them. It's a bit of a chicken and egg situation in that regards.

 

[Profondo Rosso]

Anyway, my point is, I think we need acquisitions as I just can't see this squad ever getting promoted. There are too many flaws in this squad and its players, be they consistency, lack of organisation, personality issues or whatever and I just don't think these are the kind of thing that a manager can come in and "motivate" or "man manage" players to do well every week in, regardless of how good they are technically and I think this squad of players is, taking every player as it's whole, a mid-table side.

People say MON got the best out of average players etc. but the point is they were particular players were average technically, but weren't average in other places (mentally or in physicality). To be able to get the "best out of players" they need a certain personality, to be able to have an organised team you need players who are great at positioning or great readers of the game. These are not average players at all, just that their strengths don't lie in their technical ability.

We also have to remember MON had a very poor start when he was here in getting "the best" out of players who Mark McGhee had led to 2nd in the league before he left, it was only when MON started bringing his own players in (Izzet, Lennon, Claridge etc.) that we started to move up the league. Look at Fergie, same thing there, it took him a while to get his own players in before his motivational skills showed.

I think too much emphasis is based on a manager's ability to motivate or man manage individuals, by which I mean some people seem to think they should be able to just motivate or man manage anybody. To be motivated by a certain manager, that player has to have a certain personality in the first place and the best managers will bring players in who he can motivate or man manage.

To get the best out of average players technically, these players have to have a certain mentality and this is just as much a part of a player's ability as his ability to pass the ball, or score goals, or tackle. I remember an interview with NP in which he said when signing players it wasn't just about their ability but their character as well, this is something I don't think SGE bothered with as he just seemed to go with "names."

I'm far more confident in NP's transfer policy than I am of SGE's and I'm confident that once he's gotten some of his own players in we will do well under him, be it this season or next.

 

[Biffa Bacon]

I see the forum clown has been left too close to his keyboard.

 

[Profondo Rosso]

I see the forum clown has been left too close to his keyboard.

 

[TornadoShaunUK]

Atleast Nigel realises we are under-performing rather than putting it down to our squad being just plain crap.

He has said the right things at the right time for me in the brief post match interview but whether we can believe those things is another matter. I would expect that Nigel, unlike Sven, will not suffer fools gladly and will not put up with anyone who repeatedly lacks the level of effort required. You also expect he will get involved. Having said this you look at the fact that he has stuck with his tried and tested midfield and that kind of goes against the previous statement but I think this is probably because he knows for certain they are capable of better and he has persisted with them expecting them to come good sooner rather than later. Either way I would expect and hope his comments apply to every member of the squad rather than just the latest additions as well because to my eyes, the players who have been here longer have been the most guilty of inadequate performances. King, Wellens, Dyer and Gally should all know better having played under Pearson before - maybe there is an sense of false security fro one or two of them that needs putting straight.

 

[alex]

Blah blah blah.... Spend, spend, spend... Rubbish. Coach this bunch properly and we should be achieving results better than the last three with this squad.

Today was utter garbage and a total insult to us and the King Power group. Fact. Wankers.

 

[fitz]

Blah blah blah.... Spend, spend, spend... Rubbish. Coach this bunch properly and we should be achieving results better than the last three with this squad.

Today was utter garbage and a total insult to us and the King Power group. Fact. Wankers.

Cuddle?

 

[Kingy_85]

I never called Nugent a flop, but he's certainly not a success.

7 goals in 19 matches is not great, it's mediocre and that's what Nugent has been in a nutshell. Yes, he runs around a lot and has been decent, but he's never going to be anywhere near a 20 goal a season striker at this level and he's never going to be a great creative striker either. He's a decent Championship player for a side 10th in the league, but he's not a player who should be leading the line for a top Championship side.

Konchesky I said has been a good signing yes, but he does have his follies.

St. Ledger cost ~£1.25mil, that is expensive in Championship terms! And is a million pound signing which is what I asked.

Again, you keep saying Mills and Beckford didn't start, when have I said I was talking about this individual game? Do you think our mediocre performances this season have been just about this one game?! Mills has been medicore this season and Beckford has been an utter failiure.

Beckford was rightly dropped for being shocking for about 3 months, the fact that Howard and Schlupp the only player in the squad to replace him completely highlights the problem. It is not NP's fault that League One standard players are the only back-up he has, this is not his squad that he's been left with.

7 goals in 19 games is very good at this level. Playing in an inconsistant team as well? I wouldn't expect much more from a free transfer.

 

[Dour]

I preferred that Profondo Rosso who ****ed off to Bristol and stopped posting to this new dogmatic simpleton.

 

[Lako42]

So much utter drivel is talked about on here, the constant seems to be based around the sqUad not being good enough etc... Absolute shit. That squad would make most teams in this division proud, fact is this, they all think they deserve to win games before they've played them and today Donnie hopefully taught these lazy ****s that actual passion and desire is worth more than transfer fees alone. Wake up Leicester, you were ****ing dreadful second half, men against boys.

Fans get pissed on for having opinions, but frankly after that the fans should be getting something back from those over paid twats. That was dreadful you ****s

Wow, where are the forum bum boys, Pashun!! Desire!! less well known posters have been hounded to death for less.

 

[Lako42]

****ing shit... Not good enough that, **** off you wankers

Exactly this.

 

[Profondo Rosso]

:icon_lol: Bloody hell! I don't think I've ever had so many ad hominems and personal insults directed at me in a single thread before.

 

[gregs_y2k]

One other thing that could be a reason that our defence wasn't as good as in 09/10 is that Peltier and Konchesky attack a lot more than Morrison and Berner did, because SGE brought in attacking full-backs to try and provide width from his narrow midfield, whereas NP prefers to have width from wide midfield players and have defensive full-backs.

I know one or two have suggested we've been conceding too many goals from crosses/our full-backs positions recently. Maybe we need more defensive minded full-backs, along with better wingers.

SO now Prof you want to change the entire back four rather than just the centre backs as you said before? By having more defensive minded full backs will make us even narrower than we are now! I think there is an element of the midfield not providing enough cover for the defence and this is why we are conceding more than we should.

My entire point about our squad stems from the fact that we have consistently competed with the top teams, up until Sven was sacked and then this form has disappeared entirely. It's no coincidence that we beat Southampton and Brighton and drew with Cardiff and Boro under Sven. This suggests we have a good enough team and squad to more than compete in this league. I think the poor form at home was the weight of pressure and expectation to begin with and then an aspect of arrogance against teams like Millwall and Bristol City. I think we expected 3 points and were punished for being naive and if so this was Sven failed to remedy before his departure.

Since Sven left, we have only picked up 1 point against the teams above us, I know some of these were with interim management on board, but was also using the same tactics and line up that Pearson has also adopted. Coincidence? no. We had extremely poor form against the teams above us with Pearson when we made the play offs.

We've got options, particularly in midfield, that Pearson's failing or refusing to try out. We lack width yes and I can understand bringing Dyer in to try and remedy that but persisting with the others is senseless particularly when it has clearly not been working in the last 3 games and for God sake do not start with Howard. As much as I like the guy, he is not the answer to our lack of goals scored.

 

[The Old Fox]

This squad is not of Nigel Pearson's choosing but, a good manager, should be able to get the best out of what he has, and change personnel slowly.

Are we really to believe that Steve Howard is anything but an impact player from the bench (at this stage of his career)?
Schlupp may not be ready for a permanent first team slot but what does he learn by never playing?
Richie Wellens is quoted as saying that he is unable to train regularly due to his age and yet, he is an ever present in the team.

It appears to me that Pearson seems to believe that only his signings have the character for the fight: do we expect Weale to be recalled now that Schmeichel has made an error? The last thing that we need is another change of manager but, I do not like the, Not my fault, they are too soft", remarks quoted this evening. You picked the team, Nigel: you share the responsibility.

 

[Redditch Fox]

This squad is not of Nigel Pearson's choosing but, a good manager, should be able to get the best out of what he has, and change personnel slowly.

Are we really to believe that Steve Howard is anything but an impact player from the bench (at this stage of his career)?
Schlupp may not be ready for a permanent first team slot but what does he learn by never playing?
Richie Wellens is quoted as saying that he is unable to train regularly due to his age and yet, he is an ever present in the team.

It appears to me that Pearson seems to believe that only his signings have the character for the fight: do we expect Weale to be recalled now that Schmeichel has made an error? The last thing that we need is another change of manager but, I do not like the, Not my fault, they are too soft", remarks quoted this evening. You picked the team, Nigel: you share the responsibility.

I think that Pearson has come in and recognised that the squad isn't anything like as strong as was claimed. He's reverted to players that he thinks he can rely on to put in a shift and restored Dyer to create the width and pace that was missing.

I'm fairly sure that he will move on from this position and that will need a more radical approach to personnel and tactics. Unfortunately this means more upheaval - and the worry is that the owners will run out of patience with the cost of funding the changes - taking into account the depreciation on the book value of players on whom Sven squandered their money. It was always asking a bit much to think Pearson could come in and tinker a bit to put things right. I'm with those who think that Sven nice bloke as he is, has done serious damage to the club and frittered away our short term position.
Not a happy situation - over-hype leading to over expectation and now general disgruntlement. But there really can't be any more managerial changes now.