Malta

[Macky]

I'm sure you're not.

In relation to this whole debate, there is in any case a huge difference between killing animals to eat and killing animals for sport.

Precisely.
Killing any animal for sport is despicable.

 

[spionfox]

Precisely.
Killing any animal for sport is despicable.

Fox hunters would have you believe that they are operating a pest-control policy at the same time as enjoying sport.

Win-win :icon_wink

 

[Macky]

Fox hunters would have you believe that they are operating a pest-control policy at the same time as enjoying sport.

Win-win :icon_wink

Yes, they would, but as anybody with half a brain cell knows that is complete nonsense.

 

[homer]

Precisely.
Killing any animal for sport is despicable.

What about badgers

Surely they deserve it, don't they ?

The bastards


Them and hamsters

 

[Jeff]

Killing any animal for sport is despicable.

That's why I always make sure I eat the kitten after I've used it as a football. It's what it would have wanted.

 

[FryattFox]

What about people that eat meat from animals farmed in a humane way? Human beings are omnivores, are we all evil for eating animals that have lived enjoyable lives in open fields, cared for, well fed and given medical treatment as necessary. Animals that would never have been born if humans didn't eat meat?

I honestly don't believe that there is a humane way to farm animals on anything like the scale that is needed to satisfy the demand for meat, or at all for that matter. I have far fewer objections to the less intensive and better treated animals, but I still don't think it's natural and I believe that the traditional farmyard scenes that you allude to are very rare.

I very much doubt that the majority of posters on here know or even care where their meat has come from or what conditions it has been reared in. Not that you'll care, but I commend you for bothering to know the source of your meat, whatever your motivation; it's better than not.

There is no hypocrisy. The birds being hunted in Malta could result in the entire disappearance of those species and has no relation to animals being farmed in inhumane conditions.
You're trying to conflate two unrelated situations.

I accept that point. Having re-read the article it appears that people's anger is the loss of species of bird on the island, as opposed to the welfare of the birds themselves.

There's usually hypocrisy though :icon_wink

 

[FryattFox]

The problem is FryattFox, anyone who eats that quorn or Linda McCartney shit ends up looking like a feckin albino, and as others have said there is an option to buy free-range, organic and so forth. Of course i also concede in most cases it is far more expensive (but undoubtedly better for you)...

I'm sure that there are plenty of normal looking vegetarians and vegans out there, not that I'm claiming to be one...

And free-range shouldn't be a choice; it should be obligatory.

 

[Macky]

I honestly don't believe that there is a humane way to farm animals on anything like the scale that is needed to satisfy the demand for meat, or at all for that matter.

Clearly there is.

I have far fewer objections to the less intensive and better treated animals, but I still don't think it's natural

Of course it isn't 'natural', but neither is keeping a dog in a kennel.
The animals that we farm don't exist in nature and wouldn't exist at all if we couldn't produce food from them.

I believe that the traditional farmyard scenes that you allude to are very rare.

:icon_lol: I wasn't alluding to that at all, in fact I doubt such scenes have ever existed outside of hobby 'farmers' and story books.

I very much doubt that the majority of posters on here know or even care where their meat has come from or what conditions it has been reared in. Not that you'll care, but I commend you for bothering to know the source of your meat, whatever your motivation; it's better than not.

I agree and of course I care what you think, it's actually moved me to tears.

Unfortunately, they're crocodile tears. mmmmmmmmmmmmm tasty crocodile

 

[FryattFox]

Clearly there is.

I disagree.

Of course it isn't 'natural', but neither is keeping a dog in a kennel.

Agreed. But the difference with your example is that one involves people ignorant (voluntarily or otherwise) of funding an industry rife with animal cruelty and mistreatment.

:icon_lol: I wasn't alluding to that at all, in fact I doubt such scenes have ever existed outside of hobby 'farmers' and story books.

"have lived enjoyable lives in open fields, cared for, well fed and given medical treatment as necessary."

That's as close to a traditional farm scene as most people expect, and I still don't think it's the case in all but a minority of cases as a whole.

And to answer your point, no, I care a lot less about people who eat well-reared and looked after meat. I still think that it's wrong. I believe that the vast majority of people would struggle to kill a cow, or eat one straight after watching it being slaughtered, which suggests that something isn't quite 'right' (and no, I don't doubt for a second that you are not in this group...).

I agree and of course I care what you think, it's actually moved me to tears.

Unfortunately, they're crocodile tears. mmmmmmmmmmmmm tasty crocodile

As long as it didn't suffer...
:icon_wink

 

[Darth Vodka]

what if i hunt hamsters for sport, then eat them too?

hmmm hamster burgers

 

[DesertFox]

The point that I was making is that I dislike the number of people who are hypocritical when it comes to animal cruelty and their protection. Anyone who consumes meat in this day and age is funding a cruel and inhumane practice, especially if purchasing factory farmed meat. And yet people seem to pick and choose when and where to apply their morales, on a specific breed of animals or on a single case of inhumanity.

Why's this any different to the slaughter of millions of captive animals, who aren't even given the decency of suitable living conditions before they are slaughtered?

This isn't an attack on you personally; I just find the hypocrisy of the situation bewildering.

Likewise, I'm not having a go at you but I don't buy the hypocrisy argument at all. Everyone has to be allowed to come to their own conclusions.

I have no problems with being a meat-eating environmentalist. Most of the people I work with also eat meat, despite being wishy washy lefty liberal tree hugging bird nerds. They also came to their own conclusions. Perhaps they're all hypocrites as well, I don't know.

In the same way, I'll happily argue that we should be using more renewable energy... and wait for the inevitable... I bet you drive a car, don't you? I bet you've been on a plane, haven't you? There! Ha! Caught you out!

It's the easiset and most boring point-scoring exercise ever. If you have one mild animal rights or environmental view, you have to live in a moss-covered yurt, knitting your own sustainable yoghurt to pull it off without being accused of hypocrisy.

And after all that, I still have no idea what this has to do with the illegal killing of migratory birds in the Mediterranean.

 

[Darth Vodka]

And after all that, I still have no idea what this has to do with the illegal killing of migratory birds in the Mediterranean.

NF was wondering if his bird was going to get smashed in Malta..

 

[RHYDAL]

Precisely.
Killing any animal for sport is despicable.

My Sunday lunch was killed by a sporting shooter. He gave them to me as a gift and so as not to waste them. Is that wrong?

I very much doubt that the majority of posters on here know or even care where their meat has come from or what conditions it has been reared in. Not that you'll care, but I commend you for bothering to know the source of your meat, whatever your motivation; it's better than not.

They are migratory birds which stop off here from Northern Europe. Shot in a field to the west of Cardiff.

I believe that the vast majority of people would struggle to kill a cow, or eat one straight after watching it being slaughtered, which suggests that something isn't quite 'right' (and no, I don't doubt for a second that you are not in this group...).

I didn't kill the birds, but wouldn't hesitate to do so, but will be plucking, cleaning and spatchcocking(edit away) them ready for my wife to cook.

Pretty things aren't they......



Hugh Fairly Whitty reckons they're the best tasting game birds. We'll see.

 

[Darth Vodka]

the best tasting game bird

nah, it's your mum

 

[Boy Genius]

I'm sure that there are plenty of normal looking vegetarians and vegans out there, not that I'm claiming to be one...

And free-range shouldn't be a choice; it should be obligatory.

What???
You must be a complete cock if you believe that. Given a choice of expensive free range against cheaper reared food, most people would go for cost. Out of those people it is purely down to necessity, think of a single mother with 3 children to feed, how will she be able to afford free range stuff? Her shopping basket is usually full of home label and basic brands.

 

[Macky]

My Sunday lunch was killed by a sporting shooter. He gave them to me as a gift and so as not to waste them. Is that wrong?

No, I've no problem with that. If you're gonna kill it, eat it.

 

[Boy Genius]

No, I've no problem with that. If you're gonna kill it, eat it.

.... or pass it on to someone who will eat it.

 

[homer]

Or give it to the cat........

 

[Boy Genius]

I give it to the cat........

FFS!

 

[drew]

Food Inc is well worth watching.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eKYyD14d_0