Protests in the US

[popillius]

Disenfranchised? How come?

Because they may well feel that they are being deprived of the same rights and privileges as their counterparts in other community groups.

 

[popillius]

There are no facts here, just opinions. On that maybe we can agree.

We can. However, when you make statements as if they are fact rather than your opinion, people will question you about them. Saying things are unwise and disproportionate is different to saying that you think people are being unwise and disproportionate in what they do.

Just so I'm clear. Does this mean that you approve of some people alive now being held responsible for crimes committed before they were born at the same time that you approve of some people alive now being held not responsible for crimes they are committing right now?

No. But then, I didn't say anything of the sort. What you infer or extrapolate from a post is up to you but, once again, just because you write or think it, doesn't make it any the less bollocks.

 

[Brown Nose]

What next? Just on comedy shows I'm sure a ban on Fawlty Towers is coming soon. A great piece of comedic work with racism throughout. Only Fools and Horses had plenty too. Are we so weak now that we can't cope with separating the past from the present so we have to erase it all?

And there it is, even quicker than I'd imagined . . . I'd laugh if it wasn't so horrifically wrong.

 

[homer]

As long as we can still watch Love thy Neighbour, Mind Your Language and the Black and White Minstrel Show, then all is well

 

[popillius]

As long as we can still watch Love thy Neighbour, Mind Your Language and the Black and White Minstrel Show, then all is well

What about It Ain't Half Hot Mum.... Is that allowed?

 

[homer]

Yes that’s fine - good old Sargeant Major Shut Up, Gloria and that Char Wallah

Nothing objectionable in that lot

 

[Blue Maniac]

Ah, that’s good old-fashioned family racism.

 

[Brown Nose]

It speaks volumes when people deliberately fail to address the point and divert to completely irrelevant nonsense.

 

[Payne74]

Yes I'm sure this is exactly what black lives matter is all about a Spanish inquisition type of t.v ban, when the Simpson gets banned we can get back to the football & carry on exactly as before.

 

[homer]

It speaks volumes when people deliberately fail to address the point and divert to completely irrelevant nonsense.

Ah - virtue signalling at it's finest

 

[popillius]

To be honest, I'm not advocating the banning of every single comedy or TV show that happened to say something unsavoury at any given time. We should be aware of how crass some of them were, be open in our criticism of them and not repeat the same errors however. This thread was about the rights and legitimacy of those wishing to protest about the treatment of black people over a sustained period and the harm it has caused them for generations. Like I have already said, there is a reason some of these people are so angry and feel so passionate about what is going on. They are still living in the shadow of the fallout from centuries of oppression. You have to ignore the small minority there because they want to throw bicycles at Police, they are a distraction from the real issue which is absolutely prevelant. Do I think some statues should be removed? Absolutely, and places like the British Museum also agree with the removal of some of these vile people. Do I think every TV show with an unsavoury character should be banned, well, no. But that doesn't make them okay now, does it?

 

[popillius]

Yes I'm sure this is exactly what black lives matter is all about a Spanish inquisition type of t.v ban, when the Simpson gets banned we can get back to the football & carry on exactly as before.

The problem is that I'm not sure you understand what it is actually about. Therein lies the problem.

 

[pork pie fox]

Can't even bring myself to reply to some of the basic nonsense spouted above.

New rule for me, football only on here.

Yep, I think that's a pretty good stance for me too.

 

[Fox Fan]

Recent posts in this thread are utterly depressing.

To be honest, I see the recent posts as completely the opposite. What a pleasure to read reasoned and well argued points of view that haven't resorted to name calling or labeling but have instead engaged with the arguments and offered a different view.

Yes some of the views expressed challenge my own opinions, but I think it's good to talk these things through - especially with those who have opposing views/experiences - which too frequently is not the case on social media.

In my experience the majority of people agree on where we're trying to get to, it's the route we take that people seem to get animated about. The slave trader statue, seems like almost everyone agreed it shouldn't be there in it's current form. Would I have prefered to have seen it removed in a more civilised fashion - yes, but do I think it should have been removed - yes.

 

[homer]

“Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered. And the process is continuing day by day and minute by minute. History has stopped."

 

[Payne74]

The problem is that I'm not sure you understand what it is actually about. Therein lies the problem.

Maybe you are correct that I don't understand what exactly it's all about but if you asked 10 people of there opinion how many different answers would you get ?

You say therein lies the problem but I don't have a single issue with colour, religion, race, sex, transexual or anything else so do I need to be educated? Maybe my lack of higher education is coming across in that I don't have the vocabulary to explain exactly what I mean.
I don't have a problem with t.v shows being removed or statues being taken down, but it's the way it's being done that I have a problem with, for example you get a council that is of solely white origin deciding if a statue is racist, how about you ask the local ethnic population there opinion rather than make it for them.

Maybe some of my posts are being misinterpreted & I apologise if people think that I'm somehow racist or part of a racist problem but I can assure you I'm not in anyway, I think my biggest problem is I'm very cynical & tend to look for the true reason.

If I'm not welcome on here I will gladly leave the whole forum rather than upset its members.

 

[popillius]

Maybe you are correct that I don't understand what exactly it's all about but if you asked 10 people of there opinion how many different answers would you get ?

You say therein lies the problem but I don't have a single issue with colour, religion, race, sex, transexual or anything else so do I need to be educated? Maybe my lack of higher education is coming across in that I don't have the vocabulary to explain exactly what I mean.
I don't have a problem with t.v shows being removed or statues being taken down, but it's the way it's being done that I have a problem with, for example you get a council that is of solely white origin deciding if a statue is racist, how about you ask the local ethnic population there opinion rather than make it for them.

Maybe some of my posts are being misinterpreted & I apologise if people think that I'm somehow racist or part of a racist problem but I can assure you I'm not in anyway, I think my biggest problem is I'm very cynical & tend to look for the true reason.

If I'm not welcome on here I will gladly leave the whole forum rather than upset its members.

I don't think you are in any way racist or offensive. I genuinely do think that it's incredibly difficult for anybody to understand what it is like to be part of a minority group who have suffered oppression and persecution for years unless they themselves have been in the same situation and I include myself in that. I honestly don't want to make you feel like you've done anything wholly offensive.so apologies if that's the case.

 

[Payne74]

I don't think you are in any way racist or offensive. I genuinely do think that it's incredibly difficult for anybody to understand what it is like to be part of a minority group who have suffered oppression and persecution for years unless they themselves have been in the same situation and I include myself in that. I honestly don't want to make you feel like you've done anything wholly offensive.so apologies if that's the case.

Long story short, when I was 5 I had to go & live in a foster family that was black & lived in Hackney, they had a little boy same age as me & 40 years later we are still good friends. I was there for 3 years & was the minority where we lived & at School, I didn't see black or white but people that loved & cared for me as it was very upsetting being away from my own parents.
We had a red cortina estate that we used to go out in (it was the 1970's) but I remember being stopped by the police several times & questioned why there was a white boy in the car, I vaguely remember my foster parents arguing about it.

I'm not saying I understand how it feels to be a minority because l don't, but it's why I don't see black or white.
The problem I have is the white people that are falling over themselves to ban films, remove statues & change road names are just doing it for a box ticking exercise which wasn't the problem in the 1st place.

Take a knee will only serve broadcasters with an opportunity to wax lyrical about black lives matter when what the black community really want is the same jobs & opportunities that white people get.

Listen to BBC radio 2 and it's white people on every single show, Vanessa Feltz, zoe ball, Ken Bruce, Jeremy Vine,
Steve Wright, Sara Cox, Tony Blackburn, Gary Davies & then ferne cotton. This is what in my opinion the problem is.

 

[Matt_B]

Long story short, when I was 5 I had to go & live in a foster family that was black & lived in Hackney, they had a little boy same age as me & 40 years later we are still good friends. I was there for 3 years & was the minority where we lived & at School, I didn't see black or white but people that loved & cared for me as it was very upsetting being away from my own parents.
We had a red cortina estate that we used to go out in (it was the 1970's) but I remember being stopped by the police several times & questioned why there was a white boy in the car, I vaguely remember my foster parents arguing about it.

I'm not saying I understand how it feels to be a minority because l don't, but it's why I don't see black or white.
The problem I have is the white people that are falling over themselves to ban films, remove statues & change road names are just doing it for a box ticking exercise which wasn't the problem in the 1st place.

Take a knee will only serve broadcasters with an opportunity to wax lyrical about black lives matter when what the black community really want is the same jobs & opportunities that white people get.

Listen to BBC radio 2 and it's white people on every single show, Vanessa Feltz, zoe ball, Ken Bruce, Jeremy Vine,
Steve Wright, Sara Cox, Tony Blackburn, Gary Davies & then ferne cotton. This is what in my opinion the problem is.

But surely getting the TV companies to talk about the issue and raise awareness, will lead to the ultimate goal?

 

[Payne74]

But surely getting the TV companies to talk about the issue and raise awareness, will lead to the ultimate goal?

Matt B, talk will only last a few weeks or until the football season starts & we have something else to talk about. How long has the kick it out campaign been going on for?? & yet there is still clubs & countries having to play behind closed doors because of racism. Real change would be having black people actually doing the job instead of Vanessa Feltz & Co, its not just the BBC but house of Lords, local council, English FA, Spot the black man when the F. A cup gets handed out...