Waghorn bid?

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If it's as a DJ replacement I'd be over the moon. If it's just a signing then it's still a decent signing.


So you're more happy about signing Waghorn if a player is leaving, than you would be if he's an extra player? That seems odd to me.

One of them must be off though.... we're not going to have Fryatt, Howard, DJ, Gally (who I think PS sees more a striker) and Waghorn all at the club this time tomorrow.
 
So you're more happy about signing Waghorn if a player is leaving, than you would be if he's an extra player? That seems odd to me.

One of them must be off though.... we're not going to have Fryatt, Howard, DJ, Gally (who I think PS sees more a striker) and Waghorn all at the club this time tomorrow.

Yes, because I believe that Campbell is a big negative influence on the club and I think to see the back of him would do a lot of good for the club.

If we're signing him as a replacement for Fryatt then it's a poor deal imo.
 
Campbell looked good against 'boro but he was more than likely just showing off for the scouts... i'm still unsure on whether Fryatt is actually that good... (prepares for backlash!!)
 
he had an amazing season in League 1 but for me he hasn't never proven himself in any other league... Too greedy, doesn't pass and too slow for me...
 
Finally someone that agrees with me. I've never rated him.

There's plenty of people who don't rate him.

Simply because they think misses a few one on ones he must be shit player. Yet, no one ever seems to point out that none of our strikers even get into these one on one situations whereas Fryatt regularly gets into one or two a game.

There are very few players in the country with as good a scoring ratio as him over the the past 2 years. but it is this which has hindered his reputation imo, some people seem to have him down as a "poacher" and so think he should be more clinical, which is far from the truth.

He is probably the most creative player in our squad, got our most assists last season despite missing over a third of the season, was one of the top assisters in League One when we went up. Honestly, he creates as many chances for the team as Howard, Wellens, Dyer or anyone else, but no one seems to give him credit for it. Yet everyone goes on about great Howard is at creating space and setting up goals, when Fryatt does just as much as him at both. It's just not as obvious as Howard as he doesn't "run after everything" it's far more subtle and about his intelligence and positional sense rather than because he gets other players off the ball.

The fact you mention pace says it all. He is not a player that needs pace, because he gets into those positions through thought, not being faster than anyone else.

For pretty much the entire first half of last season, we were almost single handedly relying on him as an attacking outlet. Almost every single goal we scored he had a hand in one way or another.

As a goalscorer he misses a few chances and perhaps should be more clinical, yes, but as a creative player I really don't think we have anyone better. The goals on top of that are just a bonus.

Yet Waghorn chases the ball and CRIES WHEN WE LOSE so he must be better!
 
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There's plenty of people who don't rate him.

Simply because they think misses a few one on ones he must be shit player. Yet, no one ever seems to point out that none of our strikers even get into these one on one situations whereas Fryatt regularly gets into one or two a game.

There are very few players in the country with as good a scoring ratio as him over the the past 2 years. but it is this which has hindered his reputation imo, some people seem to have him down as a "poacher" and so think he should be more clinical, which is far from the truth.

He is probably the most creative player in our squad, got our most assists last season despite missing over a third of the season, was one of the top assisters in League One when we went up. Honestly, he creates as many chances for the team as Howard, Wellens, Dyer or anyone else, but no one seems to give him credit for it. Yet everyone goes on about great Howard is at creating space and setting up goals, when Fryatt does just as much as him at both. It's just not as obvious as Howard as he doesn't "run after everything" it's far more subtle and about his intelligence and positional sense rather than because he gets other players off the ball.

The fact you mention pace says it all. He is not a player that needs pace, because he gets into those positions through thought, not being faster than anyone else.

For pretty much the entire first half of last season, we were almost single handedly relying on him as an attacking outlet. Almost every single goal we scored he had a hand in one way or another.

As a goalscorer he misses a few chances and perhaps should be more clinical, yes, but as a creative player I really don't think we have anyone better. The goals on top of that are just a bonus.

Yet Waghorn chases the ball and CRIES WHEN WE LOSE so he must be better!


Everyone loves a show of passion these days, myself included. You can never have enough grit and determination.

I agree with what you say about the start of last season, we were relying on him and nobody else seemed capable of scoring. However for me Fryatt goes missing and seems a bit uninterested sometimes, like at the Newcastle game, he did one absolute mazy run where he skinned 4 or 5 of their defenders and then did nothing else all game (all-be-it we went down to 10 and everyone was hands on deck). He scores goals, but something about him just doesn't convince me. Sometimes its his greed, the fact he doesn't pass and put it on a plate for a team mate.
 
and misses an open goal from 6 inches away... i'm still not convinced...

That's exactly my point. People seem to ONLY concentrate on his one on ones for some bizarre reason. Yet Leicester fans:

a: Never mention just how many chances he gets, far more than any other strikers in our team. That doesn't happen by luck.

b: Never criticise Howard or Heskey for exactly the same thing. Fryatt is a creative player to simply judge him on his ability in front of goal is just the same as saying Howard or Wellens is shit because he doesn't score many.
 
Whilst I'm not going to undermine Fryatt's input into the club, it's a simple fact that when he was injured, Waghorn stepped up to the plate and performed admirably. Therefore, if it was Waggy in and Fryatt out, I don't think I will be crying into my beer for too long.
 
Or why not keep Fryatt and also get Waghorn back but sack of DJ and Howard?

Fryatt and Waghorn both proved last season they can do a job to get us in the promotion mix, both scored 10+ goals from memory, and would fit in with Sousa's style of passing football rather than resulting to hoofing it to some oaf who will be lucky to get a handful of goals this season.
 
Everyone loves a show of passion these days, myself included. You can never have enough grit and determination.

I agree with what you say about the start of last season, we were relying on him and nobody else seemed capable of scoring. However for me Fryatt goes missing and seems a bit uninterested sometimes, like at the Newcastle game, he did one absolute mazy run where he skinned 4 or 5 of their defenders and then did nothing else all game (all-be-it we went down to 10 and everyone was hands on deck). He scores goals, but something about him just doesn't convince me. Sometimes its his greed, the fact he doesn't pass and put it on a plate for a team mate.

And that is largely what's wrong with English football culture and why England never do any good at International level. Trying hard is not a substitute for skill or intelligence and never will be.

Going missing vs. Newcastle in what way? Again, I think people put too much emphasis on visibly chasing the ball. To say that Fryatt goes missing because he doesn't get on the ball is missing the point. A lot of strengths involve him being off the ball. That's not to say he's not fantastic with the ball at his feet, who can turn defenders, because he is, but he gets him self into positions and is constantly trying to read the game.

If you deliberately watch him for 20 minutes you'll see what I mean, when he's not on the ball, he is always trying to fall the defender. He tries to run where he thinks the midfielder will play the ball and where he thinks the defender won't be able to get to him, rather than waiting til the ball is played to run on. When he is on the ball and passes it, he does the same. You'll even see him pointing out where he wants the ball or the receiver to go when the defender's back his turned often.

Granted, this does not come off all the time, so I can understand why people are frustrated when he is in the wrong position or plays a duff pass, but it's not because he's not talented, it's because him and his team mate did simply not read the situation in the same way. However, the fact is, this only needs to come off once to create a guilt-edge chance, which is what happens. With Fryatt on the pitch we always create far more guilt edge chances than without him on the pitch, as although everything he does doesn't always come off, when it does it invariably creates a goalscoring opportunity either for himself or someone else. We don't have anybody else in the team who can create goal scoring chances with the frequency he does.

It's exactly the same with King - another player often accused of "going missing" when he doesn't get on the ball, there is far more to football and creating chances than getting on the ball and doing something with it or running after the ball. That is something some fans really don't seem to realise.
 
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If they carry on where they left off then it will be all good... I don't hate Fryatt, i'm just not that convinced... I am getting fed up with Howards stupid child like tantrums though...
 
The bit that frustrates me, is when he gets the ball in or near the box, doesn't notice someone standing in front of goal, un-marked, waving his arms at him to pass the ball and takes a shot that goes over or wide... if he looked up and had more awareness of his team mates we would have more goals... He does this far too often for me... and Wellens seems scared to shoot when he has a clear shot...
 
The bit that frustrates me, is when he gets the ball in or near the box, doesn't notice someone standing in front of goal, un-marked, waving his arms at him to pass the ball and takes a shot that goes over or wide... if he looked up and had more awareness of his team mates we would have more goals... He does this far too often for me... and Wellens seems scared to shoot when he has a clear shot...

Again, people just seem to be concentrating on the negative, rather than what he brings to the team. Yes, he misses a few chances, but what he brings to the team far outweighs this.

And I really don't think he misses any more chances than Waghorn or Howard do. I'd love to see some shots to goal ratios of our strikers from the past 2 seasons.
 
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And that is largely what's wrong with English football culture and why England never do any good at International level. Trying hard is not a substitute for skill.

Going missing vs. Newcastle in what way? Again, I think people put too much emphasis on visibly chasing the ball. To say that Fryatt goes missing because he doesn't get on the ball is missing the point. A lot of strengths involve him being off the ball. That's not to say he's not fantastic with the ball at his feet, who can turn defenders, because he is, but he gets him self into positions and is constantly trying to read the game.

If you deliberately watch him for 20 minutes you'll see what I mean, when he's not on the ball, he is always trying to fall the defender. He tries to run where he thinks the midfielder will play the ball and where he thinks the defender won't be able to get to him, rather than waiting til the ball is played to run on. When he is on the ball and passes it, he does the same.

Granted, this does not come off all the time, so I can understand why people are frustrated when he is in the wrong position or plays a duff pass, but it's not because he's not talented, it's because him and his team mate did simply not read the situation in the same way. However, the fact is, this only needs to come off once to create a guilt-edge chance, which is what happens. With Fryatt on the pitch we always create far more guilt edge chances than without him on the pitch, as although everything he does doesn't always come off, when it does it invariably creates a goalscoring opportunity either for himself or someone else. We don't have anybody else in the team who can create goal scoring chances with the frequency he does.

It's exactly the same with King, there is far more to football and creating chances than getting on the ball and doing something with it or running after the ball. That is something some fans really don't seem to realise.

So you'd sooner have a team with no commitment or desire, a team of effortless lumps? Granted effort and no skill gets you nowhere, my Nan puts in a lot of effort to walk to Highcross and back.

But what I'm trying to say is not every player in the team needs insane amounts of skill and I just think Fryatt thinks he has so much skill that he doesn't need to try and his ego gets in the way sometimes. Possibly fans moan that he misses 1v1's because you would him to score 1v1's like he has in the past. Chasing the ball to me puts them under pressure causing them to lose the ball and I think that's why people put quite a bit of emphasis on it. Fryatt is a goalscorer at the end of the day, the most clinical we have.

We do create more chances with Fryatt but I think that is because Howard likes playing with Fryatt (yes yes I am a Howard fan). But if Howard wasn't there I do feel Fryatt wouldn't have half as many clear cut chances as he does.
 
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