A Talking Point

[Hammond Organ]

I agree with you totally about the players.

On the managers: Adams himself clearly recognised that he had reached the end of the road at Leicester; Levein never adjusted to the more competitive nature of English football...and as for Kelly - his appointment was a cop out and I wouldn't think there are many who would be too optimistic about him being the right manager to achieve much success. As you suggest, before you stick with the right manager - you have to make the right appointment. And we haven't.

Totally agree with you on that. It was a complete cop out when we appointed him. What would have happened if we had lost 2 of those games that Kelly was in charge for as caretaker? The board would have had to make funding available to get a manager, probably from another club.

 

[Darth Vodka]

whilst i agree that sometimes patience is needed with a manager...

the argument that success comes from sticking with a manager is specious reasoning, yes the two are correlated, but that does not suggest causation

winning matches keeps you in a job, the argument is circular

reminds me of the circular increased attendances/success argument

 

[OldGit]

Look at that Fergie bloke at Man U.

Almost 3 years of underachievement, everybody wanted his head, board didn't listen, and look at the mess they ended up in.

 

[newtonfox]

Look at that Fergie bloke at Man U.

Almost 3 years of underachievement, everybody wanted his head, board didn't listen, and look at the mess they ended up in.

Rk the new Fergie i dont think so

 

[Hammond Organ]

Look at that Fergie bloke at Man U.

Almost 3 years of underachievement, everybody wanted his head, board didn't listen, and look at the mess they ended up in.

I would take Man U's level of underachievement for us at any time...

 

[OldGit]

Rk the new Fergie i dont think so

Did I say he was?

I was answering the point made by several posts that fans have a right to demand instant success or the manager must go.

By definintion, a maximum of about 16 clubs in the 92 can be "successful" in any season, with perhaps the same number seen as having done well & come close.

So the instant gratification argument means the majority of clubs should be dumping their management each year. Where are they all going to find successful managerial teams with a proven track record?

 

[Ox Fox]

Did I say he was?

I was answering the point made by several posts that fans have a right to demand instant success or the manager must go.

By definintion, a maximum of about 16 clubs in the 92 can be "successful" in any season, with perhaps the same number seen as having done well & come close.

So the instant gratification argument means the majority of clubs should be dumping their management each year. Where are they all going to find successful managerial teams with a proven track record?

I think that most people would be happy if they could see some sort of progress being made on the pitch. RK constantly reminds us that this is a young team, surely then we should be seeing them improving week on week and fulfilling their potential. That clearly isn't happening and can only really be attributed to the manager through his choice of training, tactics and formation.

 

[Hammond Organ]

Did I say he was?

I was answering the point made by several posts that fans have a right to demand instant success or the manager must go.

By definintion, a maximum of about 16 clubs in the 92 can be "successful" in any season, with perhaps the same number seen as having done well & come close.

So the instant gratification argument means the majority of clubs should be dumping their management each year. Where are they all going to find successful managerial teams with a proven track record?

It is all relative OG as Southend, commendably, look like they will hang on to Steve Tilson this year even if relegated as he has done a fantastic job in getting them into the Championship in the first place. The fans still back him, and so do the board. And then there is always Dario Gradi. If he sells Luke Varney for a profit this year I am sure the board will be more than happy. The fans are still happy with him too as they know the constraints he works under. Even though they are lower mid table in League 1 now.

The problem closer to home is down to the fact that ever since we started throwing away points in the Premiership under Adams our teams have slowly started to lack fight (never mind the ability). Some of the gutless surrenders under Levein and Kelly have been shameful and unfortunately for the current management and players the halcion days under MON are not that long ago in fans memories, when we were known as the 'never say die' team.

Where does the blame lie for this? Are the players scared of reactions or just useless? Is the management unable to change the team due to finance or unable to motivate due to lack of ability? Are the board unable to provide said finance due to financial stability of the club?

At the end of day we have a mix of all of the above, so what do we do about it? The easiest option is always to change the manager, who can then go on to change the playing staff (In our case wheeling and dealing - maybe selling an asset or two on the playing side to assist in moving rubbish out and bringing options in).

I think instant gratification for us at the moment would be to have a team that fights for the cause and never gives up and accepts defeat, which has been all too evident at the moment. If RK could get the players playing with this attitude, he would find more fans on his side than not...

 

[Dunc]

I think that most people would be happy if they could see some sort of progress being made on the pitch. RK constantly reminds us that this is a young team, surely then we should be seeing them improving week on week and fulfilling their potential. That clearly isn't happening and can only really be attributed to the manager through his choice of training, tactics and formation.

My argument is that even if the manager was providing the above, the fans at Leicester aren't capable for whatever reason of backing young players and this has been the case for a number of years.

The other point about RK is that he has only been a manager for 9 months ish so he's not going to have all the answers, again you have to let him make mistakes and develop.

 

[norman leet]

The majority of managers who have left, have left by their own accord.

Even going back to Frank O'Farrell and Jock Wallace £££££

Little in fairness turned the club around more than any manager in recent times, could of been like Curbishly-but shafted us for the promised land

McGeehad us playing some fantastic football, the new 'fergie' once aagain the gready fat barstad left for the promised land

ONeilDespite his ill feeling that he still harbours over the Sheff U game, he made Leic and we made him. Stated he would only leave if sacked!..Promised land

Taylor The board gave him silly money and extended his contract when his was cocking up ..given every support and time Fired

Bassett/Adams Neither was fired, DB moved aside as planned, MA's head went after Le Manga and left

LevienMay of done it in time, but we would of been relegated first. Seemed clueless Fired

Kelly As it stands I think he will go, he has gone from acadamy to a Championship manager, needs better support and possibly an old head to guide him

Regarding players;
I think as supporters we tolerate rubbish now as a team and individuals, were getting imune to it

Rememeber "feck off Willis" times 15,000

 

[glyn]

Little in fairness turned the club around more than any manager in recent times, could of been like Curbishly-but shafted us for the promised land

I reckon if BL had stayed we'd still have been relegated in 94/95, that team just wasn't good enough (unlike the 91/92 vintage, which would have been). And then the fans would have probably called for his head anyway.

 

[Hammond Organ]

The fact that we have never gone below the top two divisions is a proud achievement for a club like ours, but also a millstone around the neck of the likes of RK and formerly CL as that does not allow them the time to get it right. Not saying that excuses them, but it is an added factor that is not there for certain other clubs (Even Brum & Man City have recently been down in those divisions).

 

[PFKAKTF FOX]

'Ah' the old it is all the fan's fault argument again.

I understand the sentiments but bearing in mind the shocking under achievement of the last 3 seasons in the championship and given that included 2 seasons with decent financial resources at the disposal of the manager due to parachute payments, and given that the last 2 years has been with a side packed with younger and more ambitious players, when you take into account the average attendences then the support has been pretty impressive given some of the absolute dross that has been served up.

Rather than castigate the fans, who pay hard earned money in supporting the team home and away, for venting their frustrations at some pretty inept and at times gutless displays, why not question the attitude and commitment levels of the Management and players, who all recieve fantastic rewards in terms of remuneration and lifestyle, and yet seem above criticism or explanation in the eyes of some.

 

[Durham Fox]

Bang on

 

[newtonfox]

'Ah' the old it is all the fan's fault argument again.

I understand the sentiments but bearing in mind the shocking under achievement of the last 3 seasons in the championship and given that included 2 seasons with decent financial resources at the disposal of the manager due to parachute payments, and given that the last 2 years has been with a side packed with younger and more ambitious players, when you take into account the average attendences then the support has been pretty impressive given some of the absolute dross that has been served up.

Rather than castigate the fans, who pay hard earned money in supporting the team home and away, for venting their frustrations at some pretty inept and at times gutless displays, why not question the attitude and commitment levels of the Management and players, who all recieve fantastic rewards in terms of remuneration and lifestyle, and yet seem above criticism or explanation in the eyes of some.

well siad

 

[Yorkshire Vixen]

super stuff pfka

 

[highland fox]

I was happy with the appointments of Little,McGhee,O'Neil,Taylor and Levien. However I wasn't happy with the appointment of Kelly and IMO he was part of the problem when Levein was here and should have gone with him.He got the job because he was the cheapest option IMO.I will support him and the team whilst he is here because they are my team but I'm not happy with him being the Manager of my Club and I can only see us getting gradually worse

 

[fosseboy83]

I was happy with the appointments of Little,McGhee,O'Neil,Taylor and Levien. However I wasn't happy with the appointment of Kelly and IMO he was part of the problem when Levein was here and should have gone with him.He got the job because he was the cheapest option IMO.I will support him and the team whilst he is here because they are my team but I'm not happy with him being the Manager of my Club and I can only see us getting gradually worse

we're all doomed:icon_bigg

 

[highland fox]

we're all doomed:icon_bigg

So you think we are better now than we we were under Craig Levein?

 

[Dunc]

'Ah' the old it is all the fan's fault argument again.

I understand the sentiments but bearing in mind the shocking under achievement of the last 3 seasons in the championship and given that included 2 seasons with decent financial resources at the disposal of the manager due to parachute payments, and given that the last 2 years has been with a side packed with younger and more ambitious players, when you take into account the average attendences then the support has been pretty impressive given some of the absolute dross that has been served up.

Rather than castigate the fans, who pay hard earned money in supporting the team home and away, for venting their frustrations at some pretty inept and at times gutless displays, why not question the attitude and commitment levels of the Management and players, who all recieve fantastic rewards in terms of remuneration and lifestyle, and yet seem above criticism or explanation in the eyes of some.

My argument isn't that its all the fans fault but it is a contributing factor for the reasons listed previously.

I for one wouldn't think that if I was a young player that Leicester fans are particularly great at supporting and nuturing youth, as our record in this area shows over the years.